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I just found your site last night and have been reading some posts. I have shared my problems with friends on another board (pet board) and the advice was to go to Al-Anon. It's not feasible in my life to attend meetings. I am not good in groups, I don't want to go, and don't have the time to go, and times aren't good. Bottom line, I hope I can get some help/insight without actually attending meetings myself.
A bit about me. I am almost 39, stay at home mother of 3 daughters. Ages 13, 11 & 7 1/2. I home school them all. I live out in the country, about 30 minutes from the nearest "town". I have been married to my husband for nearly 16 years and we have been together for 21+.
The reason I am here. My mom and her sister.
Mom has two problems. One, she smokes and it's literally killing her. She has an artery disease and nicotine is clogging her arteries and the only cure is to stop smoking. She has known this for 9 years now. She had by-pass surgery in her groins 9 years ago, along with aorta replacement. One year later, she developed scar tissue on her intestines and underwent surgery for that. A year after that, (so 7 years ago) she had a second by-pass surgery on her leg.
Mom has never stopped smoking. Says she tries. Along with smoking, she drinks. She only drinks at home now, but she drinks what I consider a lot. She can not go without her "wine" and she also drinks beer. I did the math and from what she buys each week, it means she's drinking about 24 oz of wine along with 4 beers per night. This is between 4pm when she's home from work, till about 7-8 pm when she goes to bed. If I talk to her after 7pm, she slurs her words and doesn't remember talking to me.
Mom was recently hospitalized with a ruptured spleen and pancreatitis. The spleen was due to her smoking, the artery is now blocked and her spleen is dying. During the spleen problem, the Dr. told her she has to stop drinking. She convinced herself that her drinking has nothing to do with any of her problems.
3 weeks later, she ended up in the ER again, and went into cardiac arrest and was put on life support. Again, they got her through the difficult part and again explained she can't smoke or drink. One Dr. she talked to, she had convinced that she only drinks "one small glass of wine a night, and is that OK". He said, "sure, one glass isn't going to hurt you". I wanted to ring his neck.
She was released from the hospital on the 27th. She hasn't drank or smoked since. I want it to stay that way, but have my doubts.
Now my aunt. Cheryl is my mom's sister. Cheryl is 10 years younger then my mom and 10 years older then me. She arrived at my mom's apartment on the 5th of July after being let out of jail after serving an 8 month sentence for her 3rd or 4th DUI. Cheryl did a lot for mom the month she stayed there. Things that I couldn't have done due to how far away I am, and having a family of my own to care for.
I found out last night, that Cheryl didn't come home. She called a friend and said she was in a hotel and was drinking. Cheryl is on probation for 4 years. She JUST got out of jail 32 days prior to drinking again.
She was doing well for the time she was out, but I think her life became hopeless as she had nowhere to go, no job, no money, no nothing. Time was running out on her being able to stay with my mom. She has an Ex-boyfriend that is toxic to her. But she insists she needs his help. Well, he helped her right back into a drunken stupor last night.
We haven't heard from Cheryl yet today. We never did find out where she was. She has a car that the toxic Ex gave her. Un-registered, Un-licensed, Un-insured and she doesn't have a license to drive. We don't know if she was drinking/driving or if she started drinking after she was at the hotel. I think she was drinking/driving again.
I am stuck between a rock and a hard place. I am trying to do what I can for mom and Cheryl, but don't know how to help them. When mom was in the hospital I had Cheryl toss all the alcohol and hide the cigarettes and told mom we just tossed everything. I don't know how long mom will stay away from drinking/smoking. But clearly my aunt can't stay away from it.
How do I help them? How do I avoid enabling them? How do I live my own life and not try to manage theirs too?
I don't know the first thing about Al-Anon, but hearing what people were telling me about me "playing the victim, and not willing to help myself" angered me. I mean, WHY is it my place to do something I clearly don't want to do, that would be a hardship to me, just because my mom and her sister drink. Why is it up to me to go to meetings? I don't even drink!
I hope to get some answers here. Thank you for reading my story, and being patient with me while I learn to cope with all this.
Welcome! I am sorry it made you angery to hear your best advice was to go to meetings. That is what really changed MY life.
Before alanon I worried about how to make the alkies in my life stop drinking. I spent years and years covering up for them, trying to FIX things they messed up...buying them booze, driving them when they were too drunk, paying their trafic tickets, and allowing their behavior to make ME miserable.
Does any of my story sound famiiar?
When I finally went to alanon what I learned was I was not crazy. I was jsut doing what many co-dependents do. And The way I got better was to change ME. It took several years for me. It was gradual. I saw lots of hope and lots of help little by little. AlAnon helped me see that I could not change them, could not control them and could not cure them. The only one I could FIX was myself.
Why do WE have to go toa meeting when WE are not the ones who are drinking? FOr me it was because i was jsut as sick as he was. My sickness was differnt kind. But I was definitely sick. I kept doing the same things over and over again expecting different results.
You really dont have anything to lose by giving it a try. I am sure if you dont like the group after 6 meetings or so they will gladly refund your misery. I heard somethign every single meetings I attended that I could use to make myself happier.
We dobnt give advice in alanon. We share what worked for us. For me it was definitely ging to the meetings, reading the books, and working the steps with my sponsor.
Welcome to MIP! You have come to the right place. In Alanon, we say take what you like and leave the rest. And that there are those who have been where you are. I believe that you have to take care of yourself and your own children first. This is a baffling and cunning disease. Only you can decide what is enabling or not.
I live in a rural area also. I drive 30 miles to a f2f meeting. Or 120 miles for more services and another f2f meeting. You learn alot from listening and read Alanon literature. You don't have to share unless you want. I try to plan my shopping trips to town to coincide with Alanon meetings.
Why is it up to me to go to meeings ???? because your the one looking for answers is the best i can do . What they are doing is upsetting you al anon will show u how to love them and allow them the dignity to do it thier way with out taking u down emotionally.
You may not recognise it yet but soon obsession will start interfering with your family life "they are all u think about " taking away valuable time from your own family. I too say the best advice is go to meetings for yourself there is nothing u can do about them .
You also asked what is the best way to help them > again meetings was the answer for me support them love them but don't enable. Your aunt will suffer her own concequences from her drinking after just being released from jail she obviously hasn't gotten the message yet . this is the disease it tells them they are a little smarter than the average joe and can continue doing what they do.
Thank you for your replies. I have read them each a couple times.
I don't want anyone to think that I don't think meetings are valuable, there must be something valuable in them, otherwise nobody would be going.
I have social anxiety disorder. Being around people, even people I know, makes me very nervous. It makes me nauseous to even consider going into a room full of strangers into a strange situation.
My mom's drinking up to this point hasn't really effected me. I didn't like it, I set some boundaries (no drinking at my house) and made 'dates' with her early in the day knowing she would be home before drinking time began.
My aunt's drinking has never effected me. I don't understand it, to me it's just unreal to think she would make the same mistakes again before reaching out to someone. But again, it's something I don't understand.
Last night, my aunt's drinking bothered me. First off because she had been staying at my mom's place helping mom do things she can't do yet. (cook, clean, even helping her into the bath). Leaving my mom in a lurch like that, all because she wanted her toxic ex to pay to have her hair highlighted. I don't understand that.
My other worry was her drinking and driving again. I didn't know what to do about that. I want to call the sheriff's and get the car impounded so she has no access to it. I don't want her drinking/driving and killing someone. I don't think there is anything I can do. I don't even know what type of vehicle it is or where she is.
I have been learning to set boundaries. And really, in the last 10 years I can only think of maybe 8 times that I have dropped everything to go help my mom. Five of those times have been while she was in the hospital. I find myself not taking care of myself or my family so I can be there and do things for her. She knows this and will call with requests like, "next time you're in town, can you get me some..." well to me, that means "I need this now, bring it to me". I am trying to be rational in my thinking when she makes requests like that. It's not her, it's me. I jump because I want to help her/please her, if I were in the hospital, I would want the same thing I think.
Cheryl will suffer her own consequences. I tried to be supportive of her tried to encourage her and motivate her. I gave her some things I wasn't using, since she had one outfit to her name when she got out of jail. I tried to give her dignity and motivate her to do the right thing. That was while my mom was in the hospital and I was spending time with Cheryl. Other then that time with her, I don't think I have spent time with her since I was a child.
My biggest problem is that I do want to fix everyone. But I also know I can't.
Going to meetings might be one way to obtain the answers, but can't the same thing be accomplished online? I am willing to do what I can do, but I have limits of what I will force myself to do. If there are other ways in which to accomplish the same thing, I am willing to try them. I just can't even fathom going to a meeting.
I understand about the meetings.My alcoholic husband got sober 16 years ago and I was told I would have to go to alanon meetings because he would get better and I would stay sick.I didn't think I was sick.I tried a few meetings but I have just NEVER been comfortable in them.I don't know if I have a disorder but I do not like crowds,I am not a people person,and I do not like group things.
I am not sure of the actual date I found this site but I started posting in March,this year.I think I started reading and going to the online meetings in January or Feb.I cannot tell you how much it has helped me.I have tried another face to face meeting since coming here and it was the same result.I don't fit in for some reason and I am just too uncomfortable.
I read the literature,go to the online meetings and post when I need help.I have gotten so much encouragement and support here.The combination of that and working the steps has helped me to make so many changes.As a result I am much more serene.My husband even gave me a 1 month coin because he sees a diffference.
You asked why should YOU have to go to meetings because of someone else's problem.I said that too.I resented that.What I have learned is that I have been affected by the disease of alcoholism.The disease has caused me to overly focus on the alcoholics ( and others) in my life while putting my own needs aside.I lost myself completely.I didn't think anything was wrong with me because the patterns had begun in my childhood so it felt normal to me.
You have been affected.It shows in your post.So don't go to the face to face meetings right now.Post,read,go to as many online meetings as you can.Work the steps.Get the literature.The links are all at the top of the message board home page.You will discover things you did not realize before.You will eventually lose the anger and resentment and will learn to take care of yourself.
Alanon is for YOU.It is not to help the alcoholics.You cannot do anything for them,they must want help and seek it.Trust me on this,I have been married to an A for 36 years,my father was an A and I have 3 alcoholic brothers and 3 alcoholic sisters.I am not an alcoholic but I have lived with it around me all my life.
Maybe in time I will try face to face meetings again.Maybe after sometime you will be able to as well.Most people feel they are extremely important.Maybe they are,maybe I am missing something.But this is working for me right now.My life is already better.
I'm glad you posted and hope you will keep coming.You are worth it.
I know my life has been effected by my mom and aunt, but I don't feel it has consumed it. (not yet anyway).
I know forcing myself to meetings would only make me hate them anymore. I know myself, I know I won't give it a fair try out of resentment for having to go. I am just not "there yet".
Mom called this morning, aunt called and said she had been in a hotel. Didn't confess to drinking. I told mom she needs to lay down some rules if aunt is to stay at mom's. No more meetings with the toxic ex. No driving, no drinking. If she can't abide by those rules, she needs to find somewhere else to stay. I told mom she is enabling aunt to make bad choices. I hope this was the right thing to do.
I think trying to sort all this out during a crisis time is not optimal, but it's not by choice either.
I hope, that like you, I can learn about all this, but in the comfort/protection of my own home. I am glad to hear someone has similar experience and has had success. Thank you for sharing your experience.
What would my first step be to pursue this? Book? Online meetings? I don't even know the first thing about Al-Anon. I have been reading and am just in awe at the stories. I feel my issues are so insignificant.
i came on to this board last august when i was in the depths of despair with my "A" boyf. whom had a drink and drug problem and had relapsed. im 25 yrs of age..and thought my life was over.
thru this board i have learned that i am a "co-dependant".. (i didnt even know what that was b4 i found this site) and i too...like you..try to "FIX" everyones problems..when i know its impossible...
my ex's problems affected me.... because i cudn't control it..or him... he was hurting himself and it made me sooo mad watching him..when all i wanted to do was catch him and shake him like a wet rag..until he got a bit of sense!...
its a long process.... a tough one... taking 2 steps forward and 4 back...at times...
we are all ur friends in here...there will always be someone on here to talk to, to listen to be a friend
we never judge.. we offer you support and love.... we all have to accept we are "powerless" over other peoples actions and feelings.. a hard thing to succeed in doing..
im glad u found us whittibo... welcome to our family.... luv to u and ur girls....
I hope someone can offer some suggestions for this situation, because I don't yet know enough to know what is right. Here's what has happened. (I feel like a Soap)
My parents are divorced. My aunt is my mom's sister. But my aunt called my dad from her hotel crying about not having anywhere to go. My dad went to the hotel, said she looks like sh*t, she doesn't have a voice and couldn't talk. (we don't know why that is).
Aunt told dad that aunt and mom had been fighting and she can't go back to mom's place. That is not true as far as I can tell. Mom has the potential to be very rude, and usually IS, but has been pretty good lately. Mom is OK with aunt coming back and giving some rules (no seeing toxic ex-boyfriend, no drinking, no driving).
Aunt made dad swear he wouldn't call anyone. I assume because then her lies would be found out. He went to the store to get her some cough drops and called me. I told him there hasn't been any fighting to my knowledge, that aunt wanted to get back with toxic ex, and that's the only reason she left mom's.
Aunt won't go back to mom's now, even though aunt called mom this morning and said she would be back this afternoon. Aunt has no clothes, no nothing. Dad left and didn't do anything for aunt.
Aunt is in violation of her probation. She has nowhere to go if she doesn't go to mom's. Mom just got out of the hospital and is fighting her own addictions and can't be dealing with worry and stress this is causing.
Would it be best to just let aunt go drink/drive and be on the run. Or to call her probation officer and have them go get her.
I don't want to worry about where she is, what she's doing or forbid, who she's killed by drinking and driving. If she was back in jail, we know she would be safe. But is that what's best for her? Or just leaving her be?
Whittibro: First of all welcome to this wonderful place. I think the lines of boundaries, responsibility and manipulation can be totally blurred. Obviously if you have grown up with a mother who was self destructive, healthy nutruing appropriate behavior is difficult to learn and comprehend and practice. Seasoned professionals who deal with alcoholics need to practice a lot of detachment, compassion and self regulation to deal with an alcoholic particularly when their disease has progressed to organ damage.
I feel for you in dealing with your mother and her sister. My family of origin is completely chaotic, difficult and also totally enmeshed. Every day is a crisis in my family of origin. Growing up like that I became used to being around people who lead very very difficult, tortured dysfunctional lives. That was the norm for me. I became adept at rescuing, fixing and also I hate to say this resenting. I learned my place in the world, caring involved sacrificing myself.
We have some great sayings in al-anon,one of them is that we didn't cause it, we can't cure it and we can't control it. That is so so helpful to remember when we are around people like your mother and her sister.
Al-anon in whatever way you choose to be here, is a really great tool for you to live with. There are people here who will not judge you, who will share their own experience strength and hope with you and there are people who live the program who are happy, joyous and free no matter what the alcoholic is doing.
There are online meetings here that are very powerful and useful. We go to al-anon not for the alcoholic but for ourselves to learn new tools of relating and to share in fellowship. There are no immediate easy answers but there is no question in my mind that the program is extremely helpful.
Sadly I wouldn't classify my childhood as even marginally dysfunctional. Sure we had some dysfunction, but nothing too horrible. My parents were 16 & 17 when they had my brother and 20 & 21 when I was born. Dad had a lot of growing up to do, and didn't really do it till his mid 50's. So most of his life he was pretty selfish, but we never did without.
Parents both smoked and drank since I can remember. Mom a glass of wine a night, dad would have a martini. They both still drink those evening drinks, just more of them. Neither of them drink during the day EVER. But neither of them could go an evening without a drink either.
Mom hasn't drank since she got out of the hospital on July 27th. But in my conversations with my dad and he with aunt today, I found out mom had aunt go buy her 2 small bottles of wine last week. Why this is bad is, mom shouldn't be drinking. Dr's ORDERS say, "no drinking". Not only that, but aunt is on probation, if she was caught with the wine in her possession, she would have gone back to jail. I can't even believe my mom could even put my aunt in that possession. And I can't believe aunt wouldn't stand up to her. I am amazed nobody in my family has a spine. I am the one who made aunt dump out all the wine/beer when mom was in the hospital. I didn't care, dump it! What can she do to me?
ANYWAY, the saga continues. After talking to mom and dad again, it was clear that in order to keep aunt safe, I needed to have her picked up on a probation violation. I don't know if this is the right thing to do, but with her history, I just couldn't trust her.
Mom says aunt has about 10 Rx's. Tranquilizers and sleeping pills and who knows what else her Dr. gave her. He sounds like one to just prescribe everything. Aunt has "attempted" suicide before. Taken a bottle of pills, then called someone "just in time" for the ambulance to get there and save her life. Knowing aunt was almost out of cash for alcohol, and now mad at my dad for not helping, mad at mom and toxic ex, I just didn't trust her.
Sheriff's wouldn't do anything about the vehicle, and I knew I could sleep better knowing aunt was safe and in jail, then I could if she was out on the loose or if she ever hurt anyone and I never tried to stop her.
I called the probation officer, she was shocked that I was giving the information. Due to aunt having to register the place she is staying, when ever she doesn't stay there, she's supposed to notify them. Since she's been gone 4 days, she's in violation. (I guess 5 minutes of "moving out" is violation). So the PO all but assured me that aunt would be returning to jail.
I called mom and then dad and let them both know. They were both relieved. It was like they both wanted her back in jail, but neither could actually DO it. For my own peace of mine, I had to save her and everyone around her. I feel good about what I did, I know deep down inside it was the right thing to do, but I worry about what will happen when she gets out now. Will she trust us enough to come back? Not that she has anywhere else to go. :hum:
I am beginning to understand, I think, why it's so important to be in a group who understands. Not to have an audience to listen to me, but an audience who UNDERSTANDS me.
Oddly enough, looking at my whole family, I just shake my head and wonder who I REALLY belong to. I don't know how I got this far unscathed, but I am sure glad I have.
I started with reading and reading the posts.I was amazed to see my story here told over and over.I also started going to the online meetings at the same time.I did alot of listening at the meetings,not much sharing in the beginning.You don't have to share at the meetings unless you want to.
Then I decided to commit myself to working the steps.I got some of the literature also.
I am not much for the chat room myself,but many people have found help there as well.I think just about any time of day or night you can find someone to talk to who understands.There is a link at the top of the message board.
There's no easy fix.It took us a long time to get here so it will take time to get better.How soon it happens is up to you.I think it depends on how much you embrace the program,but if you want help, it's here.Hope you keep coming.
