The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
my A is the second alcoholic i've been with in my life. the last was 16 years ago, when i was young enough to say "i just can't handle this" and move on. he wasn't in recovery yet, he was still in denial. i knew so little about alcohol that i couldn't even tell when he was drunk at first. then i figured out the pattern, i could finally recognize when i was talking to a drunk person. it was painful. after a lot of thought i chose to leave.
i never forgot the lessons i learned. so when i met this A this year, and heard he was 21 years clean & sober, i thought, "wow! this is going to be so different!" nuh-uh. sometimes we'll be talking, and if it veers into the realm of talking about the relationship, or intimacy issues, or anything other than the weather sometimes, i watch as he curls into a little ball (not literally) puts armor up all over the place, fixes his stare somewhere beyond me, i hear the icy coldness creep into his voice, i hear his words become more distant, clinical and finally cruel. and i realize, "whoa, i am talking to the same person" the ex that treated me like that when he was very, very drunk.
i've heard the term "dry drunk." i've read about it online. when i mentioned it to my A to ask if that's what's going on, he flies into a rage. he says i'm the one doing all the hurting, it's not his fault. even i stick to "i feel ..." statements, he tells me he feels attacked, beaten down, closed off by me.
i feel CRAZY!!!!! i attended my first meeting online, here, 2 nights ago. last night, he asked me to share what i learned. i said, i chose not to, it's anonymous. he got upset, told me the anon doesn't apply to what i learn, he really wanted to know. so i told him some of it ... he said he felt attacked, that i'm "closing him down." i said, "it's ok, i feel fine with not sharing what i learn from meetings" (because i also go to an offline DV support group that's anon) and he told me that if i don't share with him, then it's obvious i can't communicate and the relationship won't last.
why is he pumping me for info that i want to keep to myself?? he was a drug & alcohol counselor for goodness' sakes, i thought he'd know better! i want to keep coming to Al-Anon meetings, and i want it to be something for ME, not him. i need my own peace, my own happiness, or i can't be a decent partner in a relationship, you know?
so what do you do when you talk to someone you know is sober, but they honestly sound like they're drunk? i try to disengage politely and assertively, but that is also seen as an "attack" from me and it makes things much worse. we can't even talk for more than a few minutes at this point before he says he feels attacked or says he needs to shut off/close down/go away.
i love this man with every fiber of my being. i need to know if this is "normal," will it pass, or will it always be like this? will i be able to handle it better as i do the steps for myself? i need advice! TIA.
Welcome again to MIP. I met you the other night. Sounds like this guy in your life has just enough knowledge of program to know that if you get stronger you wont tolerate his BS any longer. I can only assume the reason he is wanting to know what is learned by you he feels as being threatening. But claiming that he is being attacked he is playing the victim role in hopes you will abandon the entire program giving him further control over you. Stay strong and by all means keep coming back.
Karen
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Nobody cares how much you know until they know how much you care. Love you all!
Karen
Welcome to MIP glad you're here and sharing with us. Being "dry" as you know does not mean that the behaviors have changed. If he's not interested in working a program and going to meetings that's his choice. It could be a number of reasons why he wants you to share your meetings with him.
My A chooses not to work the twelve steps right now, that may change someday. He's sober but I still experience the rages and manipulative and controlling behavior from him from time to time. Its gotten better... his thinking doesn't appear to be as distorted, but those coping behaviors still raise their ugly heads when the A feels attacked, blamed, accussed. I may not feel that I'm attacking, blaming, or accusing, but something in my tone of voice and my choice of words has triggered that emotion for him. That emotion is real for him I have had to learn to accept that, I can't change that for him, so I'm learning to say... I hate that you feel that way. My intention was to.... and then ask for a break and leave him to his own thoughts to calm down. You are entitled to your recovery and to live your life as you see fit. He doesn't have to like it or agree with it, maybe putting a boundary in place with regards to your own recovery like I don't feel comfortable sharing what I discuss in my meetings and if you are having trouble respecting that, its not acceptable and I'll need to leave the room until you can calm down and give me the dignity to keep that personal and private to myself.
He may feel like you are discussing him and his problems and can't stand the idea of other people giving you advice about him and your relationship. I get that alot... like what did you tell your sponser about me? Its none of his business, but I just say well I just discussed the happenings of the week and end it there. That seems to work, I don't go into detail.. he's none the wiser of what I discussed. For now I'm comfortable with that, if he eventually decides to work this program with me then I may feel more comfortable sharing more with him.
I'm learning the less I engage in his unhealthy behavior the better off I am. The less I engage it forces him to fight with himself and gives him a chance to see that maybe he is the problem and gives him an opportunity for growth. Keep coming back.
In Recovery,
Twinmom~
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"The people who don't mind matter and the people who mind, don't matter". (Dr. Seuss)
Hi Raven when I first started online here I used to shut down the screen so my husband would not see what site I was on. One day he said why are you closing the computer everytime I walk in? So I told him that it was al-anon and it was to help me cope with his drinking. I think the A does see it as a threat because we really do become stronger and stand up for ourselves more. You don't have to share it with him though remember you are here to look after your needs first. Hope this helps a little. Luv Leo xx
thank you all, it does help. a lot more things are making sense. like, when i first said i was going to an Al-Anon meeting offline a few weeks ago, he tried to talk me out of it every possible way. same with CoDA. "i've heard those meetings suck" etc. and when i did go to one Al-Anon meeting, no one even showed up, i heard "i told you so" etc. (turns out all the Al-Anons go to the CoDA meeting in this town *lol*)
i'm guessing part of the problem lies with him being "professional" at helping others with recovery. i mean, i've always heard that psychologists have the most messed-up families!! i know that's surely a generalization, but i've had to tell him many times, "you're not my therapist" and set hard boundaries and stick to them. i can tell when i'm being therapized ;)
i'll keep reading here, this place is great!!! :) my hope, my goal is that i'll be able to communicate effectively and assertively without stepping on his toes or triggering him. if that's not possible, well, then it's time to move on. but if it can be done, i really, really want to work hard on it! the good is so good for me, it's one of those "the benefits far outweigh the risks" situations.
how do you deal with the "i never had this problem with anyone in any of my relationships before, so i know it has to be YOU" accusations??
... how do you deal with the "i never had this problem with anyone in any of my relationships before, so i know it has to be YOU" accusations?? {{{{{{grateful hugs of thanks}}}}}}
hmmm.... if he's never had that problem before, why is he not in any of those relationships now?
I like the saying "wherever I go, there I am". Reminds me to look at myself. I've had several relationships, and it would be quite easy to point the finger at them as to why they didn't work out...but the one common denominator in all those relationships was ME.
Is he working a program? 21 years sober is good, but just as with us, its the behaviors and attitudes that need changing, otherwise we're the same person as we always were. As heard here, "you can take the rum out of the fruitcake, but you still have a fruitcake"...so if he's not working to change his "fruitcake" behaviors/attitudes...well. Enough said.
Keep working on you. You sound great!
Luv, Kis
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Let your light shine in the darkness. "I can't just bring my mind to meetings...I must also bring my heart."
I agree with alamom .He wants to get you isolated so he has all the control never good when one person tries to control another. keep comeing back on line and posting .. dori
nuh-uh. sometimes we'll be talking, and if it veers into the realm of talking about the relationship, or intimacy issues, or anything other than the weather sometimes, i watch as he curls into a little ball (not literally) puts armor up all over the place, fixes his stare somewhere beyond me, i hear the icy coldness creep into his voice, i hear his words become more distant, clinical and finally cruel. and i realize, "whoa, i am talking to the same person" the ex that treated me like that when he was very, very drunk.
