The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
I am not really sure where to begin. I guess the biggest question is, where do I fit into his whole recovery and treatment. I am not sure if I fit in at all, or what will happen. I am not even sure what I even am to him. I can't even really say what he is to be because his alcoholism made it so our relationship was just more a rollercoaster-- that went off the tracks a long time ago. I met him 4 years ago or so. The first year that we knew each other, that was really the only year that felt like a real relationship- even then after the first few months... and as it got longer, I saw the signs he had a drinking problem. I never realized how bad it was until time went on. That first year, I slept over his house, spent time with his family, and was sort of in a denial at times at how bad his drinking was. I remember him ruining our july 4th. I remember myself, knowing he needed help and not sure what to do or who to turn to. I turned to his parents and his sister. With his parents, it was more of an argument at their house, when he snuck alcohol (or maybe something like that)... I remember just being so upset. I basically just blurted out that your some has a problem with alcohol and his mom's response was- we know. Honestly during that moment -I was done. I had no plans on dating an alcoholic or some who has a drinking problem. He wouldn't come to terms to what was going on... and I couldn't either in a way. Early on I saw it as just a drinking problem- not that he was an alcoholic... he just needed to drink less. We made up after... but his parents never once asked me about his drinking, even though I saw him daily and they didn't. I was very upset with them, because it took me a lot to try to reach out- and it was for his sake's and I just thought they would have been more concerning. I remember texting his sister about it. We were friendly. She was probably the most honest about it. Saying he had been like that for a long time, and she kinda just learned to step back and leave it in god's hands. At the same time... don't give up on him. That first year... and I don't even remember if it was the first or second, his drinking got worse and worse. I would stop sleeping over because he would sleep walk and literally just go to the bathroom in his sleep. I woke up with him sleep walking and peeing in the corner (it was scary and bizarre). He would wet the bed. When I first met him, I would sleep right next to him and in time, I would sleep as far away from him because I didn't want to get wet. In a way I developed anxiety just by being in the same bed as him. During the second year I broke up with him for a good 6 months. I dated someone else. It didn't work out and we reconnected.. I made my terms clear-- no drinking around me. He still did (eventually...). We would break up again and again turning the next couple of years. The cause and the person who would pull away was always me. I wouldn't even call it breaking up in a way... as at some point I stopped even feeling like his gf. This past summer I went from July to November-- not talking to him. I would see him at work (we worked near each other)... I reached out to wish him a happy birthday... and then we would be back again in this game. His drinking continuously got worse over the last 4 years. To the point that when I saw him, he would be drunk on a saturday at 2pm. Even though I was in and out of his life... and back again... I was in many ways the only person who made it clear to him, that he had a problem and that he needed help. For a long time I tried to be the person to change him... I realized eventually, that nothing I could do- could make him get help or drink less. Instead I focused on my life and I told him... we can be friends/date but there is no future unless something changes. I became very used to just breaking things off as soon as I felt like he was disrespecting me. It's one thing if you want to drink... fine... but I wasn't going to sit around and watch someone I care about destroy themselves.
Honestly, out of no where he went to treatment. It was quite a -- what is this really happening... I had given up on him. We had hung out that day, and again-- I told him... we can hang out, but I don't want him drinking around me. He was all-- okay. He said he wanted me in his life. So I went in my car, and waited of him... he took a long time to come out and when I asked him about it he admitted he drank. I was upset at him. I told him I was done, that I am not going to hang out with you if you do this. He said he was sorry- and i'll be honest, I could see in a way he meant it. He had tears in his eyes and sorta was just like- please don't be mad at me. I agreed to hang out with him longer, but it had to be at my house. At my house... it's my field and there isn't booze to sneak. He got a call... and the next thing I know, he asked me what I thought about him going to treatment. I told him to do it. That next morning he called me. He told me he would miss me, and he was going... and just like that, he was getting help.
It was something I thought would never happen. He would tell me for what felt like years... I will make changes. I can do it. But it always seemed like he didn't really care. Alcohol had such a control over him. He always picked it time and again over me. Which was one of the reasons I would walk away. It sucks feeling like the person you love... loves booze more than you. I wanted him to fight for me... but he wouldn't, or couldn't. I will say, he told me his parents and one of his friends I guess found a place for him to go to... and they helped arrange it. I was happy that finally other people were doing something. I remember telling one of his friends who was like a second mother to him about it, and her reaction was really- I didn't know it was that bad. For such a long time, I just wanted someone else to feel like they care. The last thing I wanted was to hear one day, in 5 or 10 years that he died.
I don't know what the future holds for us. For the first time there actually could even be a us. It wasn't a possibility before. It was just a matter of time before I said goodbye, and didn't turn back around to see how he was doing. I loved him a lot, and one of my faults has always been, having a hard time on giving up on someone. For me... I didn't want to give up on him, because i was that one person who I think pointed out the issue- even if he hated me for it.
I am not sure how he will be sober. Maybe it's only drunk him that loves me (even though it's not the way I want to be loved). I want a normal relationship. I had them before I met him. If I could meet someone else, I am sure I would have that. I guess the thing is, in spite his flaws, I would rather be with him. He can be the nicest person. I just don't really know where I fit in now. I am not his family. I am not really even his friend. I am not his girlfriend or lover. I am basically this girl that just didn't know how to give up on him. For a long time I felt like i loved him more than he loved me (after all he loved alcohol more...)... and IDK maybe now is the time for me to walk away. He is getting the one thing I wanted him to get-- treatment. For the longest time, that is all I wanted for him. I wanted him to be able to have a future. Ideally, I wanted to be able to have a real relationship with him and a real future, but IDK if it's good for him to be with me.
I am not sure if I will see him while he is in treatment. Honestly, I didn't even really want to see him because I am scared of how he would be. He has hurt me so much, and IDK if he will ever realize that or acknowledged that. He was very upset with me for dating someone else. I am unsure of how he will be when I do talk to them. He has called me from the facility, and I missed the call. As much as I want to talk to him- I am scared to see what he has to say. I wonder if he can be sober and have a relationship. I honestly can't wait for him much longer. I have had guys interested in me, and part of me is like-- maybe now is the time for you to move on. I don't want to wait a year for him to decide he wants a relationship. I am not sure if he wants to see me at that facility. I think it would be useful as I think he needs to comes to terms to how his drinking affected the relationship we could of have, and just how it affected me. I love him and I care about him, I just don't know if he feels the same way about me.
IDK what treatment is like... honestly I have no idea what to expect at this point. I want to be there for him, but at the same time- IDK if he even will want me there for him. I've already given him 4 years of my life. I can't give him much more if there isn't a future.
Katie55, welcome to MIP, so happy you found us and trust us by sharing your feelings.
I am so sorry that you are experiencing such a confusing time right now, what you are going through is not unusual under the circumstances. Alcoholism is a progressive and sometimes fatal disease and it sounds like you are confused as to whether you should wait for him or move on. We have a saying and it is "When in doubt, don't". So I guess I am saying, if you can't make a decision as to whether or not you should wait, then don't make the decision now, but I highly recommend that you work on your recovery, because alcoholism causes a great deal of grief not only for the drinker but for those of us who are close to them. It is hard for us, because we really cannot advise you, but we can point you in the right direction.
The one thing I learned to do, almost immediately, when I joined Al Anon was to detach from the situation and I will explain what detaching is:
Detachment is neither kind nor unkind. It does not imply judgment or condemnation of the person or situation from which we are detaching. It means that we allow us to separate ourselves from the adverse effects of alcoholism on our lives. We do this in part, by accepting that we did not cause the alcoholism, that we cannot change the alcoholic or make them stop/get treatment and we cannot cure them with threats or interference. By understanding we cannot control the disease and are not the cause of the abuse from the disease we detach with love and no longer feel bad or react to their abuse.
In Al-Anon we learn: Not to suffer because of the actions or reactions of other people; not to allow ourselves to be used or abused by others in the interest of anothers recovery; not to do for others what they should do for themselves; not to manipulate situations so others will eat, go to bed, get up, pay bills, not drink; not to cover up anyones mistakes or misdeeds; not to create a crisis; and not to prevent a crisis if it is in the natural course of events. We also learn that when an alcoholic either in the thick of the disease and drinking or in the depths of recovery, both scenarios are their business, not ours.
If you would like to work on your own recovery, Al Anon starts with a 12 Steps Program which you can start on this forum if you like. You are so worth it Katie!!
You can find step 1 by following this link: https://alanon.activeboard.com/t66186431/step-1/
You would also find that face to face Al Anon meetings would be very beneficial as well, here is a link to see if there are any meetings in your locale: https://al-anon.org/al-anon-meetings/find-an-al-anon-meeting/
Please let us know how you are doing and please keep coming back!!
-- Edited by Debb on Saturday 18th of January 2020 11:05:04 PM
-- Edited by Debb on Saturday 18th of January 2020 11:08:25 PM
__________________
"Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it
does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown
Aloha Katie and welcome to the board...it took courage and that is the courage we also found to change the things we could. I could have written your introduction also because it was how I felt and thought when I first arrived at the program. I didn't know about alcoholism; how to say it spell it, or what. I didn't know and didn't know that I didn't know and yet I was born into it from both sides of my family. It got much worse and by the time I changed the things I could (me) I was as sick or sicker than my alcoholic/addict wife.
Read your introduction here as if you were a new comer and see how it makes you think and then come back and read the shares of the rest of this family.
I am not going to go on and on but just to let you know when you have questions about the disease ask anyone of us for our Experiences and then just listen with an open mind. Check the white pages for if and where we meet in your area and then go to the face to face meeting as soon as you can.
Who you are and who you are being is the only important thing. It's not about him, "us" or the couple, and so on. It's only about YOU. You need to be OK, healthy, and happy...regardless of what happens to him, because you have no power, will, control, or any say about what he does.
So...what's good for you? In my experience...One, focus on YOU. Just YOU. Get some space and distance. There is no "us" when he is in treatment and just out. He will live every single minute of every single day trying to stay clean and sober...if he wants to. If he doesn't, well, there you have your answer. Two, decide if this is the life you want to live. Three, go to face to face alanon meetings. Start doing the work. Get a sponsor. Get healthy. Get better.
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Bo
Keep coming back...
God, grant me the serenity...to accept the PEOPLE I cannot change...the courage to change the ONE I can...and the wisdom to know it's ME...
Sending you support, b/c I have been where you are currently at... except I was wondering if my 20+ years marriage would survive! Bo can be very direct... but the concept of thinking 'just about YOU,' is spot on!!!
Probably the one thing that was said to me that made the biggest impact (when I came here a second time), was "Decide if this is the life you want to live." Or to put it another way, "Decide if you can love/live with your spouse just as he is right now." For me, I had to understand Addiction (in whatever form) before I could really decide what I wanted out of my life. Please notice that I didn't say, "...understand my addicted spouse." Because one is based on facts and scientific evidence... the other is based on lies, gas-lighting and emotional manipulation... you will never truly "understand" their motives.
As with anything posted here, "You take what you want, and discard the rest." If it applies to you, great! If not, let it go. In my experience, going No Contact (NC) was the best thing for me while spouse was in rehab (both times). It allowed me time to "get my head on straight," if you will.
Keep coming 'round. Read all the stickies... they really do help!
&
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"The wolf that thrives, is the one you feed." - Cherokee legend
"Hello, sun in my face. Hello you who made the morning and spread it over the fields... Watch, now, how I start the day in happiness, in kindness." Mary Oliver
Welcome to MIP Katie - glad you found us and glad that you shared. You truly are not alone even if it feels that way! I arrived feeling very broken, confused and lost in life, love and 'more'. I have found my way to a much healthier place by embracing Al-Anon recovery with an open mind and open heart.
I hope you keep coming back and please always remember that there is hope and help in Al-Anon for those affected by the disease in others!
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Thank you for all of the support. I feel like my friends- wouldn't and couldn't understand. Their opinion is that I should have taken him out of my life a long time ago. i feel like I am in a different position than a lot of people as he is not my husband... he isn't even my boyfriend anymore. We broke up, in my eyes- a long time ago because of his drinking. For the longest time, I craved him getting help and would always say to him, there would be no future for us unless she got help. Now that he is getting help, I am seeing that there still may not be a future for us as I just don't think he is in a spot in his life likely to have a relationship. His focus should be on getting better, not on me. I am happy he is getting help as that is what I wanted for him, but sad in my own selfish way, as I can't wait around for him to be ready for a relationship. I spoke to him for the first time and was a little upset to hear about how his parents and friend visit him... but none of them have reached out to me. I just don't feel included even though during the past few years, I am pretty sure I was one of the closest people to him. Sure I would go away for some periods of time because I had to separate myself, but I know I saw him one on one more than any of his friends or even his family. I saw him at his lowest. My conversation with him felt a little weird. I was a little disappointed that he is only going to a 28 day program. I do worry about how he will be on his own. His biggest hurdle will be going back to that environment and being alone. He mentioned me driving up with him to one of his appointments- so I guess he still sees me in his life... but I feel like me being around will take the focus off him. I feel selfish, and he shouldn't have that. I am happy for him for getting treatment. It's the one thing I've wanted for him from the beginning. I don't regret being there for him and keeping him in my life even though it was difficult. At the same time, I want something- I don't think he can give me. I want a real relationship. I feel like me being in his life, isn't necessarily good. We were pretty toxic. Yes his drinking was a big part of it, but we still might be toxic even without it. I am have such an easy going personality, yet with him, I felt always so tense. I love him probably more than he loves me, and that is why I sorta feel obligated to let him have his alone time. I just don't want him to resent me for leaving. He has friends and family, and he really doesn't need me. As much as I love him, I can say my ideal and what I want is not someone who has a drinking problem. I don't think he is capable of giving me the type of relationship I want anytime soon. I also think just myself not talking to him for 3 months, 6 months, and so on, has prepared me to let him go. I have never really lost sight of me. Even when we were "together" i felt single. If you ask me who my most serious relationships were, it wouldn't include him. Why... because we never really had a chance at a real relationship. I spent the last 4 years mostly trying to be his friend. He taught me to appreciate good relationships. I had taken them for granted before him. He taught me how a substance can just shatter your life. I learned from him to accept that I had no power over alcohol. I accepted at some point that alcohol could have him, but it wouldn't have me and I would leave and focus on me. My focus has always been on me. My life, my friends, my family. I am happy I was around to see him decide to get help, as it gives me some peace of mind that now he is in a better place. I think I spent so much time wanting him to get treatment, I took no time until now, to ask myself what would happen after he got treatment. What would I do, what would he do... and I don't know that answer. One of my friends is sorta like, be prepared to no longer be in his life... and at the end of the day, I can say that I truly care more about him being on a good path than being in my life. he made me appreciate the relationships I had before him... This has always been his battle. I am not sure what role I really had or didn't have. There are some things I regret, but I am happy that now he can at least have a good life. He deserves to be happy. I deserve to be happy, even if it is not with him. As much as I wish he would realize all of the pain he has caused me, I don't need him to. I just want him to be healthy. IDK what the future holds. This is unknown territory and I have no idea how he will be like when or even if I see him again. I am happy that he is getting help though. It's just this uneasy feeling of realizing now that he might be sober and he might be able to give you what you need in a relationship, there still might not be any future. I am not sure he even loves me, or cares about me. I use to tell him that if he cared about me and had no plans on actually changing he needed to let me let him go. I am happy he seems focused on his recovery. I just don't really think he can have a relationship right now.
Alanon is about not allowing our minds to race. About not writing scripts, not creating, living in hypotheticals, about not living in and creating stories, and so on. It is about being present, dealing with the next thing in front of you, doing the next right thing in front of you, for you.
Your focus is on him. On what he's doing, can't do, doesn't want to do, what he's capable of, what he wants, and so on. There is your first problem.
Go to face to face meetings. As many and as often as you can. Get a sponsor. Start doing the work. I did these things, with a laser precision focus, and getting better was the most important thing in the world to me -- like staying clean and sober might be to your ex-bf, and if it is, that's all he is going to deal with, focus on, etc. -- I did whatever I had to do to get better, and I did! I was out of the abyss in 30 days and on the road to recovery.
All the best.
__________________
Bo
Keep coming back...
God, grant me the serenity...to accept the PEOPLE I cannot change...the courage to change the ONE I can...and the wisdom to know it's ME...
Katie - glad that you spoke with him and glad that you're feeling supported and understood here....that's one of the many gifts of recovery - those who participate do understand (friends and family rarely do) and can share their ESH (experience, strength & hope) for you to consider. Most in recovery do not give advice or direct another - there are exceptions.
My days and life go much better when I consider me as a loved, stand-alone person imperfectly created to be 'here'. Anytime I start to project what my life looks like with another - husband, son, friend, etc. - it's usually wishful thinking and not productive. We just never know what tomorrow will bring, so focusing on me and my needs, just for today, serves me much, much better.
He will be given a ton of suggestions in treatment and for his transition plan to 'normal life'. One of them will be to put him, his sobriety and his recovery first. Both AA and Al-Anon suggest no huge changes for a while, and AA strongly discourages relationships for at least a year. This is simply so one can get healthy, and then hopefully pick a healthy partner and have a healthy relationship. Of course, there is no black/white rules for either side! He is going to do what he's going to do and family/friends are encouraged to embrace their own recovery and healing.
I hope you keep coming back and I hope you find the courage to try some local Face to Face meetings. The first I attended was overwhelming and didn't 'feel right' for me. The second group I visited felt like a good fit, so I started my journey there. You should find unconditional acceptance, support, beginner's information, phone numbers, etc. at a healthy group! Al-Anon is a gentle program, designed for family & friends affected by the drinking of another. We come together to deal with and heal from all the various ways this disease affects us, and each is allowed to work recovery in our own time frame. It was helpful for me to be able to begin my journey while my 'person' was in treatment!
You are not alone - there is hope and help in recovery! Keep coming back!
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Katie, I am also glad you got to speak to him and happy that you see the situation the way that you do.
It sounds to me like you know that you need to move on for YOU.
Please continue to come back to this board for support and definitely find an Al Anon group near you, because I can tell that you will do very very well in Al Anon and member support in face to face meetings would be a game changer for you!!
Blessings!
-- Edited by Debb on Monday 20th of January 2020 10:05:27 AM
__________________
"Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it
does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown
I also had to try about 4 meetings (different times and places) until I found one that I felt I could stay & feel supported. It was worth it.
&
__________________
"The wolf that thrives, is the one you feed." - Cherokee legend
"Hello, sun in my face. Hello you who made the morning and spread it over the fields... Watch, now, how I start the day in happiness, in kindness." Mary Oliver
He called me again today.It was more just him talking about what is going on in there, and what he will be doing when he is done. I like hearing from him, I am nervous about seeing him. I've never seen him sober really. When we first started to date, I am pretty confident he was drinking (i just didn't really notice it because he hid it and I just had never experienced those issues in my life.) I have never been a big drinker. I am hoping he will want to see me and it won't feel strange. I hope he includes me in the process and I do hope I am able to help him. I want to support him in whatever way he needs, if he wants my support. I also at the same time, am going to focus on me and try not to think about us. I think he will likely spend more time with his family, which is good. I found it really concerning this year where it felt like he hardly saw them for any of the major holidays. It's nice hearing the change in his voice and just hearing things I never thought I would hear. I am trying to think of what we can do together as fun now that he is sober to just make it easy. I feel sort of up and down. I know moving on would be easier, but I care about him a ton and I am not going to just walk away unless he wanted me to. I will likely try harder to spend time with him, since I think it would be better than him being alone (that's if he wanted to hang out, even if it's just us grabbing dinner or me trying to get him to go to the movies.). I know he is going to have a busy schedule, but that is good. Before I spent a lot more time just doing my own thing because I wouldn't want to be around him if he was drinking. I am looking forward to having more than a 10 minute conversation with him. I am not sure if I will hear from him again before he comes back home. I sort of wish I was closer to his family. I haven't tried to be around them in at least a year partly because of how up and down we are. My mom doesn't even know I still speak to him. I know she would tell me I could do a lot better. I just care about him. A big reason I no longer went to his parents house is I just really didn't like how they never seemed really concerned about his drinking. At the time that i felt that way, I still was in the mind set of- I could get him to change. I've realized a little that chances are they have tried things, and just accepted, what took me a long time to accept. I would see them once in a blue moon just when I was out for a run outside, but I have no idea if they knew me and their son still talked. I've always had my own life and at the end of the day, I tried to be a good friend and whatever the hell we were/are etc. I work in an area where I see a lot of substance abuse issues- I just work in a different side of it. I am not blinded by it. I know it's a long process. I've done a ton of reading on it before he went to treatment. I am happy to be at this point, but also scared. I was very used to the drunk him. IDK what the sober him is like. IDK if the sober him will like me. I know I have hurt him and he has hurt me. I know he has felt like I have abandoned him at times, which is partly why I made sure to reach out to him during treatment as I don't want him to think I can move on with the snap of my finger. If I do move on... it's not an easy choice. I just know, no matter what, I am happy he is better today than he was a month ago. A month ago there was no future... today, IDK what the future holds. I really just want to hug him, and let him know as a friend- I am proud of him. As a friend, I am here.
I know that when the ex A was in treatment it was a very hard time. Some people do treatment many times over
Having been in a ling re kn relationship with an alcoholic/addict I can understand how significant it is
Ina kn ways felt I revisited the staying with the alcoholic relationship over and over
Letting go requured a lot of support
There is a lot of support here .
Welcome
(((Katie))) - I hear you! When my qualifier(s) were in recovery, I would sit and wonder many 'what ifs'...and each/every time, the outcome was different than I projected - sometimes way better and other times, just way different. My best suggestion is to just breathe....breathe in deeply and try to focus on Just this Day. We have a bookmark in Al-Anon that came to mind as I read your share - posting it, hoping it provides some peace for you!
Just for today I will try to live through this day only, and not tackle my whole life problems at once. I can do something for twelve hours that would appall me if I felt that I had to keep it up for a lifetime.
Just for today I will be happy. This assumes to be true what Abraham Lincoln said, that "Most folks are as happy as they make their minds to be."
Just for today I will adjust myself to what is, and not try to adjust everything else to my own desires. I will take my "luck" as it comes, and fit myself to it.
Just for today I will try to strengthen my mind. I will study; I will lean something useful; I will not be a mental loafer; I will read somethign that requires effort, thought, and concentration.
Just for today I will exercise my soul in three ways: I will do somebody a good turn, and not get found out; if anybody knows of it, it will not count; I will do at least two things I don't want to do--just for exercise. I will not show anyone that my feelings are hurt; they may be hurt, but today I will not show it.
Just for today I will be agreeable. I will look as good as I can, dress becomingly, talk low, act courteously, criticize no one bit, not find fault with anything, and not try to improve or regulate anybody except myself.
Just for today I will have a program. I may not follow it exactly, but I will have it. I will save myself from two pests: hurry and indecision.
Just for today I will have a quiet half hour all by myself, and relax. During this half hour, sometime, I will try to get a better perspective on my life.
Just for today I will be unafraid. I will enjoy that which is beautiful, and will believe that as I give to the world, so the world will give to me.
Keep coming back!
__________________
Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Katie... you 
& 