1. Does the group abide by the Traditions in all of its affairs?

I believe the majority of the traditions are in place, but there seems to be issues, that I am sensing, concerning personalities sometimes over-riding principles, and those principles are suppose to be based on unity with only one authority - a loving God that expresses himself through us in our group conscience, per the Traditions. Our only purpose is to welcome and give comfort to families of alcoholics, that is this groups primary aim.

2. Do we criticize others in the group or gossip about them?

I do sense some criticism happening and it is uncomfortable at times.

3. Are group business meetings held at regular intervals?

I believe so.

4. Are group business meetings conducted in a manner that members feel safe to share opinions?

I believe so.

5. Are members pressured by dominant members to accept their ideas?

I sense that this maybe going on, and again it is uncomfortable and not appropriate.

6. Does our group have a process for the minority voice to be heard even after weve made a decision?

I believe that the moderators of MIP are very accessible.

7. Do members purposely reveal their length of time in Al-Anon or Alateen to gain credibility during group discussions?

I do not see that happening at all.

8. Are we forming cliques or being indifferent to other members of the group?

I feel that maybe happening, but also feel that some members stay in the background because there are unaddressed issues.

9. Is the group process adequate for informing members about local, Area, and worldwide Al-Anon/Alateen events and concerns?

Yes, I feel we are an open enough board that information can be readily shared.

10. Does our group undertake service projects on its own or in conjunction with the district, Al-Anon Information Service, or Area?

Not that I am aware of.

11. Is our group active and supportive at the district and Area levels? Do we send representatives and financial contributions to the district, the Al-Anon Information Service (AIS), and Area as well as to the World Service Office (WSO)? Are there ways in which the group is not fully self supporting?

No, not that I am aware of.

12. How does the group show its support for Alateen? Is Alateen literature available?

I believe all literature is available via links on this board.

13. Are several eligible Al-Anon members certified to be of service to Alateen if a local group needs help?

I believe so!

14. Do we have a literature display of Conference Approved Literature (CAL)? Do we regularly reorder CAL? Do we have a group lending library

I believe all literature is available via links on this board.

15. Does our group process for selecting a Chairperson/Leader for the weekly meetings encourage members to volunteer to serve? Are the Chairpersons/Leaders prepared?

Yes.

16. Do all members have an opportunity to participate in service to the group?

Yes.

17. Is there rotation of leadership in the group?

I believe so.

18. Does the group have a process for handling problems? If so, are members aware of the process?

I believe so, this inventory, hopefully will help us address and solve this boards issues, if there appears to be any, by consensus and adherence to the Traditions. 

   Debb... 

                   Find that there are subtle "small p" politics in any group. They are more than manageable here, for me, at least ...

                   I have become healthier, and I tend to attract healthy people, [I think!]

                   Hotrod runs a steps and traditions forum. Also, maybe some group issues can be addressed on our group business form???

                   It is good for members to have a voice- and to be heard...! ...

Thank you Betty, David and Aloha! I did ask Betty if she would like me to post this Inventory. It is completely up to everyone to determine if they would like to participate and if they find that it would be beneficial.

So...David...in your opinion...I can't help but ask...what this the group conscience? Or was this simply the closest this group got to one this time?

wow, thank you for posting the information!!  I am not surprised by the lack of participation, this group has a history of not wanting it to be "real" Al-Anon and still, good things do happen.

To me, it is unfortunate when it starts looking more like a social media or blogging site, with little or no mention of Al-Anon solutions.  To me, the Al-Anon message itself should be safe-guarded  within a thread but I do recall John F. cautioning members about this site not being responsible for anyones safety or recovery.   And that seems realistic to me, though I have often wished  the capability of logging in and NEVER posting a single visible word would be removed, secrecy is creepy.

My F2F meetings read simple meeting guidelines that carry reminders of our traditions. An environment of self-control and discipline does aid recovery all around. (And still, we all have to walk out of meeting rooms and figure out how we're going to be okay in a world lacking self-control and discipline, ha!)

This is a popular reading at most meetings I attend, from ODAT page 353:

THOUGHTS TO TAKE TO AN AL-ANON MEETING

I will make sure that what I say will be helpful to someone, and not merely use the meeting as an audience for my troubles. I will listen to everything that is said so I will have some constructive ideas to take home with me and use.  I will not yield to my compulsion to go on talking after I have made my point and what I say will have a direct relevance to the subject of the meeting.  If someone asks for advice, I will give it only in terms of Al-Anon principles, and not suggest action to be taken.

These guidelines are read at my Sunday meeting:

In Al-Anon, we share our own experience, strength and hope - keeping the focus on ourselves and how the Al-Anon program is helping us to change our personal attitudes and actions.  All Al-Anon discussions should be constructive, helpful, loving, and understanding. In striving toward these ideals, we avoid topics that can lead to dissension and distract us from our goals. We ask that all members refrain from gossip, dominance, discussion of religious beliefs, and criticism of one another, including the alcoholic."  (then it goes into discouraging crosstalk.)


I believe the quality of any group comes down to "obedience to the unenforceable,"  when members behave unselfishly, wanting the best for the whole.   I am fortunate that whenever I felt I had outgrown a group, there was always another waiting for me (Higher Power is sooo GOOD) 

This site is where it all began for me, when a stranger looked up my very first meeting.  I wish the same outcome for everyone who finds their way to MIP.

Godspeed (((all)))

SF, thank you for sharing your thoughts. That is why this inventory was posted. I took the full inventory and if you notice, I addressed the same issues you have, thank you again. Please do keep coming back to let us know how you are doing.

My view of our Al-Anon group:

1. Does the group abide by the Traditions in all of its affairs?

I think it tries to and succeeds. 19 times out of 20, at least...

2. Do we criticize others in the group or gossip about them?

I hear nothing. if there is a lot of that about there is always an atmosphere. I think the atmosphere here is really good.

3. Are group business meetings held at regular intervals?

The only real need here, so far, is the annual Tradition 7 meeting- which has always worked well.

4. Are group business meetings conducted in a manner that members feel safe to share opinions?

Yes... members of all MIP 12 Step groups are called in- and every member given the opportunity to take part.

5. Are members pressured by dominant members to accept their ideas?

Not that I can see. If I sense the teeniest bit of conflict I use "I" statements. That seems to work for me.

6. Does our group have a process for the minority voice to be heard even after weve made a decision?

I believe that to be the case. I don't think we have tested that one [no need to] while I have been here.

7. Do members purposely reveal their length of time in Al-Anon or Alateen to gain credibility during group discussions?

8. Are we forming cliques or being indifferent to other members of the group?

9. thru 13 don't really apply to us

14. Do we have a literature display of Conference Approved Literature (CAL)? Do we regularly reorder CAL? Do we have a group lending library.

No, but references to literature and to Alanon CAL is supplied by members when asked.

15. Does our group process for selecting a Chairperson/Leader for the weekly meetings encourage members to volunteer to serve? Are the Chairpersons/Leaders prepared?

Members tend to pin up readings from our three readers- at regular intervals

16. Do all members have an opportunity to participate in service to the group?

I believe so...

17. Is there rotation of leadership in the group?

There are service leaders here, who provide readings. Debb you show good service by pinning up this checklist and leading the discussion.  

18. Does the group have a process for handling problems? If so, are members aware of the process?

I think our process is largely informal. We have mods to ensure group safety.

Personally I have a good rapport with all the regular members. I think our approach to newcomers is good. However asking the questions... is even better- not to take this for granted.

If anyone reading this wants talk about any of these points I have raised they are most welcome.

I am sure this process will work out well- and maybe the group should consider doing this in January of every year.

So maybe , if I got a seconder, this could go up as a remit on our business page. ?

Thanks,

DavidG.

    Thanks Debbs...  ...

        I reflected on the inventory, and it fits into my dream for this year. Focussed around tradition 5.

       Just tonight I compared the AA Declaration with the Alanon Declaration... both written differently...

The AA declaration begins and ends with the words- "I am responsible." And in Alanon, right from the

get-go we learn to cease being responsible for alcoholics. At the same time there is a tremendous depth

of interest and concern for the alcoholic addict. Compassion. Strength.

Our declaration is equally significant:

I think that the outcome of this inventory will undoubtedly bring to light for everyone, any issues that need to be addressed. Since I asked Betty before posting this, if it was in the best interest of MIP, I feel that the outcomes will be viewed. I also believe that by doing the inventory, which David and I have done, allowed us to bring to light any concerns and hopefully everyone will feel the same.

SF we never disregard or disrespect anyone's feelings on this board. You are always entitled to your opinion, you are and were not a jerk and there is no need to retract what you said! You should only be concerned with your well being at this point, so please keep coming back to talk to us about YOU! {SMILE}

 Sunny:  I read that original posting. We were all asked for input- and that was your truth at the time. I did not comment then- because I had not shared on your thread.

All:  No cross-talk. I have seen this rigidly imposed on a group. Gulp! I think it is about boundaries. Because we all seem to have issues with boundaries- we have to learn- somehow. It is great on an online group because we can backtrack.

      And there is no denying what has been said!  ...

I always say here- that our greeting time, sharing time, and coffee time are all rolled into one. For me- virtually every regular member here, and me have had coffee time- at some time... and we can always talk when we need to. For me and my friends coffee time is not gossip time at all... but we do talk about stuff in a commonsense sort of way. Sometimes a bit of general chit-chat is nice too! 

I learned not to give advice. Just opinions- and only when asked for.

Sometimes we have threads where everyone pitches in with comments. "Take what y'all like and leave the rest"- sort of stuff... and this is a part of our group culture...  ...

Bo wrote:

---

Sunny, I believe your post had some credence to it, and I agree with some of what you said.

Based upon my experience, I am confident nothing will come from it, but that seems to be the standard operating procedure around here.

---

 Bo... when this process is over- I would like to go to our business board and ask to have this inventory every year- in January... 

DavidG wrote:

---

Bo wrote:

---

Sunny, I believe your post had some credence to it, and I agree with some of what you said.

Based upon my experience, I am confident nothing will come from it, but that seems to be the standard operating procedure around here.

---

 Bo... when this process is over- I would like to go to our business board and ask to have this inventory every year- in January... 

---

David, my experience here, and my expectations of this group are far different than yours. In addition, I think it is a fallacious exercise before it even starts. In my opinion, this is nothing more than an effort to give some appearance of credibility to an insincere exercise.

  Bo... I got "winged" one time for quoting another member!!! This was on the MIP business board, mind you!

          All business issues around here, I close my eyes- and think "standard meeting procedures". Not that I would

          try and impose that- but it helps me focus on what stage the "meeting" is at.

Quoting can be a form of cross-talk... but on business issues open and frank discussion would be the norm!

Horses for courses, maybe...?

Bo - I am going to take a chance, because I know I'm going to be inundated with a huge dialogue from you, so here goes......... MIP and it's members, since I've been a member going back 2014, has always followed all 12 Traditions. What I see happening now is you are the only member, at this time who is not abiding by Traditions 2 and 5. I will let you look them up yourself. MIP has always been sincere in it is goals to honor the founder of this forums wishes that, Al Anon states: That this place should be a place where everyone can share their experience, strength and hope in order to solve their common problems. We believe alcoholism is a family illness, and that changed attitudes can aid recovery.

Good theory David. However, your "standard meeting procedures" might be different than mine, others, etc. Be that as it may, let the process take flight...and see where it flies.

Debb wrote:

---

Bo - I am going to take a chance, because I know I'm going to be inundated with a huge dialogue from you, so here goes......... MIP and it's members, since I've been a member going back 2014, has always followed all 12 Traditions. What I see happening now is you are the only member, at this time who is not abiding by Traditions 2 and 5. I will let you look them up yourself. MIP has always been sincere in it is goals to honor the founder of this forums wishes that, Al Anon states: That this place should be a place where everyone can share their experience, strength and hope in order to solve their common problems. We believe alcoholism is a family illness, and that changed attitudes can aid recovery.

---

Debb, no, you won't be inundated. I am not here to argue, present a case, or anything of the like. I shared my experience and what I've seen happen here on this BB. That's all. Maybe others would read it and interpret it differently. That's fine, and expected. I see red, you see scarlet, someone else sees ruby. Neither is right or wrong. It is all personal and subjective, subject to interpretation, etc.

If you feel I am not following the 12 traditions -- specifically 2 and 5 -- thank you for pointing that out. I appreciate it. While I appreciate and respect that you feel MIP has always been sincere in it's goals to honor the founder, that is not what I was speaking to at all. In addition, everyone here at one time or another cites alanon principles, procedures, guidelines, and the like. However, is it not done selectively? Rhetorical question. I come here to share, learn, listen, etc. Not for politics, personalities, bureaucracy, or lack thereof. That said, I will refrain from any involvement in this discussion because as I said the process should move forward and people should participate and contribute.

As I ponder this discussion, I want to thank Debb for the topic/discussion/inventory/information.

I am now and always have been one who embraces positive change, especially if/when it leads to healthy growth. In spite of sharing that I, as a moderator, provide this service only to keep posts/posters 'safe', others forget at times that I am an equal member too. As a member and a moderator, I get Private Messages, some of which just want a private discussion and others attempting to report posts that offend others. I am reminded with each message reporting posts/posters that I am powerless over other people, places and things.

I agree that doing an inventory with an online group only is a difficult task. Not impossible, just difficult. Gathering input, compiling for discussion, voting, implementing, etc. is a huge undertaking. A recent post where a member tried to suggest she felt unsafe here gave an awesome share from Tom...

"I don't post here nearly as often as in the past, but overall I think MIP follows the old 90/10 rule.... At least 90% of the time, the board is what we all hope/strive for - encouraging, sharing ES&H, and listening to each other. We ALL (me included) need to remember that we are all "Miracles in Progress", and no single one of us is smarter than the next person, so that we don't have the authority to advise and direct. I have caught myself doing that in the past, and I try hard to deal with this "God complex" that seems tied to my own thoughts, will, experiences, and belief systems."

This helped me greatly. I agree with this completely - most of the time, this board is what we want it to be. Where we fall down is when we give opinions, advice, drift from the suggested topic, cross-talk, etc. I find we do best when we offer gentle, loving support and ESH. As a personal choice, I stop reading a post when it starts with, "You SHOULD..." I avoid You, He, She in most of my posts as a noun, simply because it's an easy way to focus on another vs. self.

Many members have not posted in this discussion nor tried to answer the questions. I do not believe it's apathy at all but rather fear - goes back to feeling unsafe. Nobody, as an adult in recovery wants to be told what to do nor be the recipient of a post that suggests what they are doing or have done or are thinking is wrong.

In our face-to-face meetings, we have done inventories. We do allow members to remain anonymous, if desired. We do consider all feedback, input and answers without bias, personal opinion, etc. - compiling it for discussion at business meetings. My experience is that many members (myself included) shy away from business meetings. I am more than willing, when I do not participate, to accept, embrace and practice what the group conscience decides -- this is not always the case for others. 

So, for me, I will continue to be of service as I have been and will willingly make changes agreed upon by the group conscience.

I agree as well as to the safety of the group members and their participation. So how does the membership go about making this inventory anonymous? Would it be that responses be directed via private message to the moderators?