(((Twinkies))) Your post really struck a chord with me because I can so relate to everything you wrote. I also feel basically repulsed by my AHs attempts at even the simplest of affections when hes been drinking.  Like you, I also recognize that he wants to love and be loved. He unselfishly provides and tries to keep me happy the best he can within his disease. I TOTALLY understand!

 I find for myself I can show affection and express feelings for him when he is most sober.....earlier in the day.  I have no patience for slurry, blurry attempts at conversation or otherwise once hes well past it meaning anything anyway. I have decided I need to honor my feelings on that.  Once the guilt trips start, I simply say that we can talk about it in the morning when were less tired and more clear.  He might still grumble, but hes not in his right mind and I need to do what is best for me in that moment.

His guilt trip might have gotten to you, but you held to your boundary. This is such a tough road....the good news is we are learning how to live life on lifes terms one day at a time.

Sending you my best,

Ellen

Twinkies wrote:

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Im struggling with maintaining my boundaries tonight. AH is drinking and as is my usual response these days, I chose to walk away and do my own thing. I was in bed watching tv when he came in and wanted to cuddle. I just couldnt do it. I didnt want to be close to him in that moment. So I started to get up to leave, which of course led to him trying to give me a guilt trip. There was nothing I could do or say that would have made a difference so I hesitated just long enough for him to get the words out, then I simply responded Ok and walked out. He followed up with 2 texts still attempting to make me feel guilty. And Ill be damned if it didnt work a little bit. Im now here in the living room with a huge nervous, guilt-ridden ball of anxiety sitting in my stomach, wondering if I should have just stayed and given him a few minutes of affection. I cant deny that overall, hes a good man who asks very little of me. And when I think about it in those terms, I feel awful about myself, like Im being completely selfish and ungrateful for the many blessings I have in my life. Yet, I know that despite all of that, I also deserve peace and being near him when hes drinking takes that away from me. I guess Im still trying to figure out how to reconcile those two things - how can I both love and appreciate the man who obviously loves me and provides for me with no questions asked, who trusts me implicitly, and wants nothing in the world from me but my love and yet be comfortable with my need to be away from him so often,

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I hear you, so loud and clear, it's screaming at me! This is something I struggled with for years. That said, for me, it was about something bigger. While I felt that my wife was a good homemaker, took care of the house, our life, etc., and I know that she loved me, without question. She also never really asked anything of me -- aside from wanting me to accept her drinking, and that's also part of a much larger issue and discussion -- However, that wasn't something that I could view as "enough" or "satisfactory" for me to unconditionally "be affectionate" or "intimate" with her, simply when and how she wanted...especially when she was drinking. Most of all, YES, this violated my boundary. Now, I did have to view it as a VIOLATION, because it was. Why? Not because I made a rule, or made a decision to simply not be affectionate, or intimate, with her when she was drinking. I certainly wasn't punishing her. I wasn't trying to make a statement or teach her a lesson. I wasn't being rude, nor was me not being intimate or affectionate punitive in nature. 

There were reasons -- many reasons -- why I made that boundary!!! Let us not forget that. If you established this boundary properly, for the right reasons, with the right motives -- and I use the word "right" in a very specific context -- then, I see nothing wrong with standing by and honoring your boundary. I see no reason why you should feel guilty. This however is what alcoholics do -- they use guilt, manipulation, gas-lighting, blame, anger, love, affection, passive aggression, and more...to deflect, to be in their denial, to get what they want, and to get us to do what they want. Period. I found that violating my boundary -- being affectionate, being intimate -- in these types of situations, and this may seem or sound extreme, but, it wasn't "healthy" for me. It had consequences for me. There was a cost attached to it. I would be doing something that I didn't believe in, that wasn't sincere, or genuine, and by just going through the motions...because maybe she "deserved" it, or because it wasn't that big of a deal, and it's just a little something she wanted...that often made me feel worse! It made me feel like I wasn't being healthy, and yes, to some extent...I was ENABLING!!! That may be a discussion for another time, however, my boundary was there for me! To protect me! To protect me and to make sure that I could be and stay healthy. My emotional well-being, my own peace and serenity was in question.

Sure, anyone can say, it's no big deal. Why don't I just do it. I can get through it. I can sacrifice. Anyone can justify and rationalize it. Perhaps anyone can justify and rationalize anything. Isn't that part of our disease, isn't that the slippery slope, and so on and so on. For me, violating, not honoring my boundary, is a slip. It can be similar to the alcoholic having a slip. We can debate all day and all night long whether or not it's the same thing, and we can also debate that it's "no big deal" so to speak. Even if there was no consequences...that does not have to mean it is OK for us to fall victim to guilt, manipulation, or anything of the like. Even if there was no consequences...that does not mean I have to not honor my own boundary.

As far as reconciling the two...well, I view that as simple. I can love the person and hate the disease. For me, it's about ACCEPTANCE. I can detach from the person, because they are drinking. I can detach physically, and I can detach emotionally. My boundary is that I would not be affectionate or intimate with my wife when she was drinking. I had my reasons, and every single one of them was FOR MY HEALTH AND WELL-BEING. That being said, if I violated my boundary and did it, even if ended up OK, and I ended up feeling OK...it is still not a reason for me to simply violate my boundary. That is the tail wagging the dog. Justification, rationalization, vacillating, all of it...those are not my tools that I use for me to be healthy. I have to NOT do those things for me to be healthy.  

Now, I will say, I just didn't listen to her and walk away. I didn't give her the courtesy of letting her make her case and speak, and then I just walked away. I would say something. I wouldn't look to argue, get into a back and forth, and I certainly would NOT have an in-depth conversation or discussion with her...because she was drinking!!! However, I would politely, and in a kind way, reiterate my boundary, in the context of a reminding her what I was doing, and a brief, simple, close-ended why I was doing it...and I would always add to it..."and while I don't want to get into this with you right now, I will certainly talk with you about this at a later time" or something along those lines. And I meant it. I would -- say what I mean, mean what I say, and I wouldn't say it mean!!! Even though she was drinking, I took the high road! I did the next right thing in front of me, for me. Sure, she would use guilt, manipulation, and everything else she could, to either make me feel bad, guilty, etc., or to get me to do what she wanted (be affectionate, intimate, etc.). But, if the alcoholic is upset with you...because you are honoring your boundary...then you are doing something right! Even if violating your boundary would be no big deal...standing by it and honoring it is you doing what is best and healthy for you. That, has nothing to do with the alcoholic.

All the best.

I think you handled it so well, Twinkies.  You took care of you and reinforced your love be for him.  Every instance is indeed different, and I learned so much from you and the other responses to your share.  Thank you for posting and reaching out.

Ellen