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Post Info TOPIC: It'd be nice to just speak plainly.


~*Service Worker*~

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It'd be nice to just speak plainly.


I really had to shake my head tonight and make a decision to do something differently. I'm not sure what or how, exactly, but...something.

There's this ridiculous dynamic of dishonesty and game-playing between my myself, my grandmother and my mother and it's so tiring.

Here's today's example. 

My dog had something wrong with his ear. I mentioned it to my mother because she is a dog-lover and she said, in a "tone" "Well you'd better take him to the vet right away then, hadn't you? THAT won't be cheap".  (She gave me a card with some cash in it for my birthday the day before and the implication was unmissable). I immediately wished I hadn't mentioned the dog to her.

Anyway I went and got an ear-wash for dogs to try before spending $150+ at the vet and thankfully it seemed to do the trick; happy dog is no longer shaking his head violently to one side like he is possessed or trying to scratch his ear off. Mission accomplished, no big vet bills, whew.

So my grandmother calls and demands to know what I am doing about the dogs ear (she's talked to my mother) but she wants to know for a different reason; she cannot abide people spending money on animals and wants to make sure I haven't done anything foolish like taking him to the vet. I tell her I took care of it myself and yes, dishonestly I imply that I in fact used "something I had lying around" because even saying I bought the ear-wash would merit an angry "you're a fool Melissa".

She also wants to know how much the trip I am planning with my daughter next November is and I tell her it's "not too much" and she grills me relentlessly saying "tell me. TELL ME" until I tell her and she tells me I am "ridiculous". Sigh.

Next up mum calls and wants to know have I taken the dog to the vet and when I tell her I got something that fixed the problem I then have to satisfy her requirements that it was a good quality properly certified veterinary product in a gold can with a platinum nozzle cut with diamonds that were mined from one of the moons of Jupiter..Then I think crap, now she'll tell my grandmother I bought something for the dog. Which was actually a $10 spray from the pet-care section of the supermarket but mother didn't need to know that...

She asks about the trip and when I tell her I've booked the cheapest airline (it's a 1 hour and 20 minute flight) she wants me to know that they don't serve meals on that airline and it's uncomfortable and from the sounds of things they whip the passengers and make them shovel coal into a big boiler which powers the engines. But oh well, it's only an hour and 20 minutes so I figure we can probably manage. 

Now the actual concerns they express to me don't upset me because in each of their ways they are just trying to pass on their wisdom and care; what's frustrating is the imperative to be dishonest. My mother ends about 80% of our conversations with "you'd better not tell your grandmother" or even offers me a script of what she would like me to say to her. 

Gah.

Any time there is an issue with my daughter she tells me not to tell my grandmother because "then she'll ask me about it". I am really starting to find this absurd (it used to just be normal). Like when daughter had her meltdown a few months ago and I took her to start counselling I was told not to tell my grandmother and when I told her recently that I had in fact mentioned it mother almost had a fit because "THANKS A LOT MELISSA NOW SHE'S GOING TO ASK ME ABOUT IT AND WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO SAY???" She was really upset that I had somehow "dropped her in it" by discussing something that had nothing to do with her with my grandmother.

A couple of years ago my fridge broke down and I couldn't afford a new one so my mother ended up giving me an old one my grandmother had asked her to get rid of. I was given strict instruction NOT to tell her as she didn't want me to have it because it's from paleolithic times and needs defrosting every 5 minutes and this is not apparently something I am able to do. I believe my grandmother told her to give me a different fridge; I'm not sure what the story was exactly; I was just extremely grateful to have something to keep my food cold and didn't really care about the politics of it. Blah blah fast forward to a few days ago when my mother mentioned she was going to bring my Grandmother to visit me and what were we going to do about the fridge? She had this plan where I was meant to drape scarves and things over the fridge and cover it with pictures to disguise it and pretend it was my messy "decorating". Oh dear God. Really?

And these nonsense games used to be normal and make sense to me but now they don't. Like any time I discuss anything at all to do with my daughter, money, plans, anything really, they both caution me to "make sure your ex-husband doesn't find out" and come up with scenarios where he finds out (I'm talking about really inane stuff like picking her up from school early for a doctor appointment or if she hands in her homework late) and in these scenarios he takes custody of her and destroys my life and brings about the end of the world while he is at it. The funny part of this is that whenever my ex husband tries to boss me around they tell me to "tell him to *&^%" but when I don't express fear or concern about him they start coming up with these stupid scenarios. I don't see him as a threat anymore and it's just nutty. I think I mentioned a while ago that I told my mother I was going to have a bath and she told me I'd better not fall asleep in the bath and drown because then he would somehow "take all of my stuff". It's not logical and honestly it crosses way over the line of concern and becomes absurd fear-mongering.

And yes I'm having a bit of a laugh writing this out because it is absurd but I am also very interested in finding a way to move past it. My al-anon tools have helped me rebuild a lot of bridges with these amazing women and a lot of what they do and say makes so much more sense (whist making less sense) when I realise that each and every one of us has grown up with a heavily alcoholic and abusive father and gone on to marry alcoholic abusive men. And part of the coping skills seem to be keeping everything a secret, lying about everything because if anyone found out the "terrible truth" the consequences would be unthinkable... so I understand that all of this deceptive nonsense is about trying to keep us all safe from a whole bunch of exaggerated fears. It's a legacy I don't want and refuse to pass on the my daughter.

But I'm not afraid of my ex-husband, and I'm not afraid of my mother or my grandmother or anyone else for that matter. I'm also not afraid of anyone uncovering the "terrible truth" of me, my lifestyle, my parenting habits or anything else and these conversations are tiring. I'm all right, they are all right, there isn't a boogeyman waiting outside every door and enough with the cloak and dagger!!!!

At the same time I see how emeshed they are in their coping systems and it is for sure not my place to rattle their cages or demand that they do things my way. I value having a relationship with them and the daily chats, I just wish I could speak the truth and not have every word turned into a disaster scenario and being urged to fabricate a cover story for every little thing.

So today my mother was trying to give me a script "just say this and then this and then this, but what if they say this? No, wait, maybe we should say this...." and I grew impatient and said "how about we just speak the truth, Mum. It's probably going to be a lot easier to remember" and she seemed mortified. I project (yes, I project) that she will now decide that she "mustn't tell me anything because I might tell someone". Which is maybe for the best, IDK. 

Anyone else deal with these kinds of demented family dynamics?

 

 



-- Edited by missmeliss on Wednesday 8th of July 2015 11:37:55 AM

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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)



~*Service Worker*~

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(((((Mel))))) Sorry I see a whole ton of humor in your telling of this and I'm bordering on stomach cramps from the laugh.  I love you for your guillotine humor...I really do.

Hugs biggrin



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~*Service Worker*~

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Glad you got a smile out of it Jerry
It felt good to write it out, put it into perspective and laugh at it.

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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)



~*Service Worker*~

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MsM I agree with Jerry I too found your account amusing but could so identify with the content.

My family still engages in this type of deception but I no longer play along. A number of years go I stated this is all too confusing and I cannot remember to keep these stories straight I know that if I am honest I do not have to remember the stories so from now on I will be honest.

I know that I do not get to hear much of the insanity any longer but when I share what I am doing and what i believe by validating myself they no longer go into their song and dance.-- Win-win

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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


~*Service Worker*~

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Thanks Betty, as I was writing it I realised that all I really stand to lose is being privvy to information that I really don't want anyway. It will be a relief really. I'm sure we can find other things to talk about!!



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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)



~*Service Worker*~

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awwYou are so wise my dear  and you will  be surprised at what  great conversations will surface



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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


~*Service Worker*~

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Missmeliss, LOL, thank you for sharing and yes I have to be careful of my topics of

discussions with my Mom who is very sensitive to any relationship that I may have

with anyone else in the family including my Dad, son, daughter-in-law and

grand-daughter.  Mom has to know every detail and control all information related to

any contact that I have with any of the members of the immediate family, because, I

believe she has to be the center of everything.  She would call all members involved to

verify and then try to outdo anything that I experienced.  She would repeat things I tell

her with her twist on it, which would cause misunderstanding that I would have to explain, 

without making it look like she is blowing stuff out of portion.  I just keep it simple now

and only have contact with everyone, outside of phone contact with Mom, on family birthdays

and holidays.  Kind of sad, but it beats the constant turmoil she creates if I try to 

maintain any contact with the rest of my family.  Fortunately my daughter lives 

with me so Mom can't control that, and because of my Mom's nonsense, daughter will not

visit with her.  Mom feels a real compulsion to compete with me, which is, if she just took a step back, 

totally unnecessary.  She would be loved for just who she is, but she lacks the

confidence to accept that and feels she must be the center of attention all the time

in order to feel loved.  I feel sorry for her and it is just easier to let her, at the age of

83, just live in peace.  So I do understand what it is like to live with dysfunction!!!

xoxoxo

 



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 "Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it

does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown

Debbie



~*Service Worker*~

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I have a family member who is much as you describe Deb, misusing information and competing with myself and others to make everyone look like terrible people and herself a saint. It's very frustrating and would be doubly so from your mother.
I think my mum is just sure everyone is going to get into trouble if they don't follow her exact advice and say the words she has scripted for them. I don't think there is malicious intent although my siblings and I get incredibly frustrated at being told which words to say in any given situation. It's really, I think, very similar to the way a lot of us plan out the scenarios in our heads and imagine who is going to say what, except to an extreme. But to me it feels as though she believes me to be too stupid to think up words to say in even ordinary situations, or that I will embarrass her if I say things that I thought up all by myself.

Maddening, all of it but of course we can't change people and yes, we best let them live in peace and detach as much as possible

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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)



~*Service Worker*~

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Thank you Missmeliss for your shares, and today's especially!  You have such a special way

of communicating and just love to read your ESH!  Isn't life a kick?  biggrin



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 "Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it

does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown

Debbie



~*Service Worker*~

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It is if we let it be
And thank-you too!

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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)



Senior Member

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oh my gosh, your family was just like mine, just because they are deceased doesnt mean i dont hear their ridiculous comments in my mind like i had to hear all my life

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ALYCE R KINIKIN


~*Service Worker*~

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Oh my......great writing & story Missmeliss and yeppers....I can relate! We are a large extended family on my mom's side, and she's the oldest of 4. There are 14 kids between the 4 and then we all have kids and most have SOs or wives/husbands.

In my family of origin, secrets were not to leave the home - we were fine, everything was fine and life was close to perfect always. This was how we grew up so my mom became known as the "Perfect One". Next in line, sister 2 had 6 kids, was married to a drunk and was always poor and had issues. She became the poor pitiful one. She was a super wonderful deeply loving profoundly smart experienced woman - lovely to a fault and has since passed.

Next came the quiet one - she has 3 children who are also perfect - one even had a child out of wedlock, and it must have been immaculately conceived as she would never engage in premarital sex. Lastly is the oops sister, who was 12 years behind the other 3 and her children are princesses as she still supports them - they are 35 and 40.

There is chaos, this disease, dysfunction, drama and more at every family event. I don't have to go to far to people watch. What every single person in my large family knows is if you need to chat with someone who will not share, it's me. I don't gossip and I don't tell anybody anybody else's story/experience/etc. I've got closed, closed lips - always have.

I had to learn the hard way to be guarded about what's going on in my life. While my parents love me dearly and would do anything to protect me, they - like most - do not understand about addiction and recovery. Even though I've been embraced in recovery/12 Step programs for almost 28 years, they still think it's a matter of will-power and self-control. It's easier when asked about another to tell what I can that's important (so-so is sick, so-so is in the hospital, so-so is getting married) and avoid any topic that's got any subjectivity.

I never discuss politics, religion, recovery, spirituality, salaries, finances with friends or family. It just doesn't go well at all...I will say though that I do 'get it' kind of with respect to parents and grand-parents. My boys are now adults - 23 and 21, but there are times when I still 'see' them as little guys with eyes all wondering and innocent. I too at times offer advice when not asked - it's intended with love vs. annoyance but I can tell it's received different than intended!

I do agree - you've got a great way of telling the story(s) and I always enjoy your share! As my parents have gotten older, I keep asking about them and what they need and what are they doing, etc. Keeping the focus on them so as to avoid talking about me/my world - which for their conversation - is great without issues!!

Keep smiling!



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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging.  Pause before assuming.  Pause before accusing.  Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret.  ~~~~  Lori Deschene

 

 



~*Service Worker*~

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I remember talking to a healthy friend once, and I said, "I'll tell you this, but don't tell Elaine..." and she said, "Oh, if you don't want me to tell Elaine, better not tell me the thing, okay?  Because I don't do secrets very well.  So just don't tell me, okay?"  That brought me up short.  Brilliant healthy thinking!  Since then I've stopped saying stuff like "Don't tell so-and-so..."  All that trying to manage people's feelings and reality, isn't it?  Sounds like you have good perspective!



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Newbie

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Absolutely! It is refreshing to know that we are not alone in these experiences. Almost every conversation with my mother has the "don't tell your sister, etc.. " comment.

Thanks for your post.

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