The material presented
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beware! I'm frustrated...don't say I didn't warn you.
I've been minding my own business. I have not discussed alcohol or drinking with my AH since he started full-blown, all day-everyday drinking again. (Last month he actually stayed sober for a week and a half after his blood pressure went crazy high and his doctor told him he needed to stop drinking. This is the third doctor to tell him this, not for the same health issue though) I did tell him, one time, very nicely, "hey - quit hiding your empty beer cans all around. Just throw them in the trash when your finished. I know your drinking. You don't have to try to hide the cans" (he just leaves them in random places behind things in our barn, etc...so annoying...what I wanted to say is "do you really think your hiding your drinking? because you smell like a brewery and look like a drunk, talk like a drunk and act like a drunk, but alas, I didn't)
so he has become stressed with work (self-employed) and started really spiraling down (in my opinion, this cycle I have seen sooo many times) and when he gets this way he pulls away, in every way...it really makes me start feeling like the kids and I don't exist to him and it hurts. So I talked to him and told him I was there for him and our business and I want to help in anyway (concerning the business) and shared with him how it makes me and the kids feel when he pulls away and is pretty much absent in our lives...well he said he thought he had been doing really well lately (what?!?) and said he knew he needed to try and cut back on the drinking, but needed someone to tell him he shouldn't be drinking so much (OMG for real? What the he_ _ ever!) so he wants me to breathalyze him each night when he gets home from work. (Seriously??) he wants me to be his accountability partner. (he's never given a damn about what I think up to this point...) I'm just floored. He is so in denial about this. I just don't even know what to say or do because I am so frustrated by the fact that he does not see he cannot beat this thing on his own (or with my help, for goodness sake!) when I shook my head, he got mad and said "see - I need your help and you won't help me" How can I deal with this craziness? What do I say? This is a disastrous proposition. I can't do it - is that wrong?
You are too close to him to be his sponsor, therapist, and it's not appropriate to be mommy to him either. All these roles are set ups for failure so he can blame you again when he doesnt stay sober. Basically, the whole proposition is ridiculous for a husband and wife. He is lucky to be self employed. Having to deal with a boss would be more stressful and he probably would have been fired already. The "stress" is stuff all adults face. A job, wife, kids...lame excuses to keep his disease active. Not to paint your AH evil. It's not that. It's classic alcoholic king baby and crazy making bs and him trying to shove the disease off himself and onto you.
I'm sorry Fairlee. Very well put pinkchip. It's a setup for blame. It's an A's classic "heads I win, tails you lose" declaration.
I'm not well versed enough to help you with how to/if you should, take any specific tack to express to him that his choices and the consequences are his responsibility.
Maybe something like "I can help you manage our home. I can help you manage our business. I can help you cook, clean, repair, find things, and put things away, but I can't control your drinking any more than I can control your thoughts or you can control mine. It's not possible, and if I try, there will only be more stress for both of us, not less."
It's the matter-of-fact truth, but the problem is, A's never let the truth get in the way of shirking responsibility.
I'm not sure, but you might want to add "semi-hidden beer can picker upper" to your talent list, annoying as it is.
Sorry fairlee I cringed reading this. My A tried this in quite a few different guises....asking me to buy and ration alcohol to him (so he could get drunk on the first night and angrily threaten me until I gave him all of it...surprise!) and demanding that I take control of all of his money and only buy him "what I thought was right" etc. Eventually I saw them for what they were, yes, attempts to indulge his every vice and blame me for it.
I started refusing to play along and therefore, he "wanted to try but I wouldn't help him". So in his mind there was no way out of his little game for me, he was going to drink and gamble and act crazy and blame me and me agreeing to it was just a minor detail that worked for him either way...
In the end I just said no. The way I phrased it was "I am afraid of what you would do if I tried to enforce this when you were drunk, and I do not want to feel afraid". I repeated it over and over and he still tells everyone he is unemployed and in debt because "I wouldn't help him". It's an unwinnable game but you can decide not to play, even if he keeps rolling the dice and moving your piece around the board for you, ugh!
(((Fairlee)))
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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)
I don't know if this is funny or sad but my AW has a breathalyzer as well! I want no part in that game. Nor should you in my opinion. It is there responsibility and theirs alone to quit, we didn't cause it and we surely can't cure it!
My wife uses her breathalyzer to ensure that when she gets in the car the interlock won't go off cause she still has drunk breath from the night before. And the scary thing is the interlock comes off after 2 1/2 years at the end of June. Did she learn the lesson? Nope, just figured out a way around it. Now she'll be back behind 4000 lbs of metal.
It has taken me a lot but I have released my stress over this situation, it's Gods will if she drives drunk and kills herself or someone else. I can't continue to worry about it everyday. The only request I have and will go to the cops on is I find out she drives with our daughter drunk. That is my one "cross this line" boundary I will not cross.
If you are having a hard time saying NO with love and detaching, you might use a third party to 'get out of the middle'....
If you have a sponsor and discussed this, I am certain you would get guidance on how this is enabling and not on your side of the street.
So, perhaps you just factually state, I love you and will support your recovery, but my sponsor and program don't allow me to be accountable for your recovery. Nothing more - less if possible.
There's another post here about FACTS, just state the facts without any justification, rationalization, etc. Plain Ole Facts...
The reaction from him (unknown and we shouldn't project) may be the same as previous exchanges, but you've done your part, spoken your truth and set a boundary all in one.
I do applaud him for some level of awareness of an issue. I know we all think it should be very obvious, but the disease tells the user that it will be different, better, not as bad, etc. each moment of each day. Remember cunning, baffling, powerful and progressive - the disease. Us, in recovery - progress....not perfection.
(((Hugs))) to you as you use your tools in this situation. Welcome to vent anytime! That's why we're here - solutions for recovery!!
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
I do remember that my ex A made no sense and had this ability to put things in a way that made me crazy... eventually I felt crazy and when I would try to explain it to anyone not in alanon I did sound crazy and my friends and family reacted as if I was destroying the relationship with my craziness... no one knows our path except those who have walked it.
anyway I especially related to the hidden beer can thing,, I don't think they are hiding the beer cans from us so much as hiding them in general ... maybe they don't want to see the huge pile all together in one place after a night of drinking.. makes it harder to be in denial about how much they really drink.
after he moved out I found cans and beer tops everywhere for well years I think.. I'm cleaning out the house to rent or sale it now and I bet I still run across a few.. it's been 4+years but I bet they are around..
The hiding thing is just another way of ignoring reality for them.
Glad such a great point about the hiding drinks. I never thought of it that way. My AH hides his drinking and goes outside for a smoke but has a drink (the nips from a liquor store) in his car. It is so frustrating as I feel like it would bother me less if he just was open about his drinking and drank in front of me. Instead he drinks in secret which I know is very common in alcholics.
It is ridiculous isn't it? No wonder why the last word of the 2nd step is Sanity. I use that Higher Power to mentor and lead me thru out my daily life now. The alcoholic/addict is gone now and then I learned that the only problem was me and the only solution God. You're getting a lesson on the definition of alcoholism and its only a lesson which has value regarding your part in it. What ridiculousness I had to deal with was only my own reactions to my alcoholic/addicts under the influence behaviors. I had to learn new ways of responding after I thought about the situation...what it was like and how I responded to it. My sponsor taught me to think about how I wanted a situation to end and then do the things necessary to get that. Simple rocket science...most of the time what I wanted was sanity, balance and peace of mind and serenity and I found out that wasn't my alcoholic/addicts responsibility and only mine. So I continued the program...steps, traditions, slogans, literature, prayer etc...only for my own need. Her drinking and using stopped being an issue in me not arriving at serenity which is Al-Anon "sobriety" Keep working your program you'll get there. How are you going to do it differently if it happens next time? If he doesn't change there will be another next time. Keep coming back (((((Hugs)))))
Wow, it is amazing the similiarity to our situations. I wanted to warn you. I tried this with my AH, being the "drunk cop" so to speak, and all it did was cause ALOT more fighting. It lasted a week. He said I was putting him under a microscope...... I feel you pain and sorrow and frustration. However, you are a great person for saying you will be there for him and the business.
Oh, Fairlee. My closet drinking AH hid 25 big bottles of brandy, 5 big boxes of wine and various other things under our chicken coop! I had no idea. He was being treated for epilepsy because he had a grand mal seizure in the hospital where he was being treated for acute pancreatitis. But "since he didn't drink," he was treated for epilepsy for over a year when he was really a binge drinker. He was in truth in detox in the hospital and that's why he had the seizure. I had no idea and was his Mommy for the next year and a half until he fell out of bed and I had to take him to the ER for 6 staples and his blood alcohol was .392. After 2plus years of face to face meetings and truly embracing the steps of Al Anon, and immersing myself in letting go and letting God in both of our lives, I am so grateful to be recovering from the abuse of 20 years of marriage to this sick man whom I adored. I hope you see you are in a place of recovery for yourself and that's the only one you can affect. There is such wisdom from sharing our experiences here and hope for a bright future for you. Your destiny does not depend on him. He is just living out his disease. We don't have to join them. We have a choice. I hope you see he is no different from any other alcoholic. Sad for him, but his life is his and yours, thankfully is yours. You will find yourself changing and becoming stronger and saner as you embrace this program. I only hope the very best for you. I am joyful now. You can be too.
I cringed reading this. My A tried this in quite a few different guises....asking me to buy and ration alcohol to him (so he could get drunk on the first night and angrily threaten me until I gave him all of it...surprise!) and demanding that I take control of all of his money and only buy him "what I thought was right" etc. Eventually I saw them for what they were, yes, attempts to indulge his every vice and blame me for it.
