The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
All my and my AW's friends are A's. Much of my AW's family are A's.
I unceremoniously dropped the whole gang about 6 months ago. No lecture, no speech, no big blow-up that THEY saw, (at home is a different story). There are only a few family members who's disease has had a negative effect on my life, and I do not see them often.
Now that I am feeling better, I am tempted to go hang out again. I don't want to drink (never been a problem), and none of these people care whether I do or not. But I'm terribly lonely on weekends when she is gone and I'm left here alone to stew.
None of them cause me any problems, only my AW does, and she goes and hangs out whether I do or not.
Any advice or reasoning as to whether or not I should rejoin the gang?
I would prefer to make new friends, but I work from home and don't have access to people (which is why I spend so much time here!). And I've known all these friends for years and I like them.
I find myself wishing there were meetings on Friday and Saturday nights so I could at least have the opportunity to see if there are any people with whom I have something else in common other being a qualifier. Also, I go to a Monday eve meeting and a Wed. Noon meeting, so at the end, everyone heads out pretty quickly.
So far, while I like going to the meetings for their purpose, the other members are all a generation or more ahead of me and I would doubt we would have much else in common.
I don't go to church, and am not going to, so that's out of the question.
Finding serenity to be soothing, tranquil, desired...and lonely.
Isolation was my biggest enemy, really, when I was first trying to get well.
I don't think it matters whether people drink or don't drink. I actually know very, very few adults that don't drink to excess. It's the family I grew up in, the friends and partners I have felt comfortable with... but the difference is, the majority of those people don't mistreat me, blame me or try to bully me into fights or dramas even when they have been drinking; even when they are drunk. So it's irrelevant to me and none of my business and I don't avoid them just because they are drinkers although I'll avoid drunk and annoying people of course, who wouldn't. Like my sister, who is much bigger and stronger than me...well when she is drunk she grabs my arm and steers me around making me talk to people etc as if I am some kind of bored mannequin on roller-skates, I don't enjoy that. My mother repeats herself and asks the same questions over and over when she's drunk and I like to avoid that too.
What matters is, how do YOU feel around the people in question? And I guess, secondly, will it be easy for you to not discuss your wife with them? Because that's tempting to do and counter-productive to all of the wonderful growing you have been doing.
If they're nice and respectful is there a reason you can't hang out with them sometimes and also make new friends as opportunities present themselves? Need it be one or the other?
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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)
The reality is that I'm not avoiding them, I'm avoiding my AW, and since I'm trying to detach, I'm thinking it should carry over to that activity. The second reality, (thinking this through) is that because I've been handling it this way, I haven't had to be around the AW when she's at her worst. The last time I was around her when she was beyond her regular, daily dose (there's the weekday dose and the Weekend dose because she is functional) she immediately started up again.
It would be hard to explain my absence, and the AW has had multiple opportunities to explain it for me from her drunken point of view and I don't want to even go there in my mind.
I guess the majority of my serenity is that I've been avoiding her. I'm just getting going so I think I better protect that. I don't miss hanging out with her, it's the other people, and she'll cloud that, so what's the point?
I'm pretty isolated by my job. I'm not a club person or organized activity person. I don't have many opportunities at this age, while still married, to meet new people.
So that's going to be a new pet project. Something to work on. Maybe since I'm starting to feel better, I won't blow off the few opportunities that have presented themselves anymore.
Transitioning from being angry and not wanting to be around anyone to being happier and not having anyone to be around.
I don't like the self-pity that's creeping in, so I have to nip that in the bud RIGHT NOW!! Better is better...right? Can't argue with that!!
I didn't realise you meant seeing people with your wife drinking, I thought you meant seeing them separately. Yes I can see how that could be a potentially negative experience.
I'm someone who doesn't do well with isolation, but I also only need company is fairly small doses. When I am feeling very isolated I find making the effort to just go to a shop where I knew a short friendly conversation will take place or walking the dog in a popular dog walking spot and chatting to other dog-walkers can ease the loneliness and help me feel human and connected. Then I can go home and feel much better about living in front of my computer, lol.
Actually not long ago I met a really cool lady when I was out walking my dog and she invited me to join a local husky club. I haven't attended any of their events yet because I am not club person or an organised activity person either, lol...but she sends me invitations and we chat online sometimes. It's nice to know the outings exist and I am welcome to go to them. I might one day.
I suppose I'm saying, there are small ways to be less isolated, without committing to a club or going hunting for new best friends....or maybe I'm saying get a dog...lol.
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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)
That's very helpful MM. Thanks. A little is better than none at all, and like you say, it probably won't take much to satisfy me. I'm going to work on it. I've got a couple of dogs. Couldn't live without them!
I found the opposite was true for me. When i jojned alanon i was lonely, i had isolated myself. Now i can be in any company and enjoy myself. Maybe not a room full of active alcoholics for long but i have found i can accept people as they are and so this allows me to appreciate people for the joy they might bring me and i can then walk away when i choose. Its all a choice.
I would look inside, whats your motives for not joining your friemds? Do you think it will send your wife a message and she might get sober? Are you blaming or judging your friends for your wifes drinking? i did this. I would fall out with people who were drinking with my ex as if they should know better. I played the martyr as well. There is usually an underlying thing gojng on inside us in my experience.
The issue seems to be that I have no friends of my own. For nearly 20 years we've done everything together and they are OUR friends. I think when I started, it was away of saying to her - "this relationship is ending, I'm going to start emotionally moving out". I've thought that it might be a positive example for her to join her and not drink, but experience has taught me that she is not interested in any example I set, I never drank much before anyway, so I'm not putting stock in that as a motive to join her.
I believe my motive has changed from the one stated above, to one of commitment to progress in healing. I have just begun this journey, and am probably on shakier ground than I would like to think. I don't like being around her when she drinks. She becomes engaging and will probably test me a little more than I am ready for. I'm going to refrain for a while longer and put my energy into trying to find another way. I'll revisit the topic after a get a little more practice with the tools under my belt. First and Foremost, focus on self. Focus on learning. Focus on practice. Focus on the HP.
When I realized that I needed healthier friends, it was a challenging transition. But I knew the people I had been hanging around with were not good for me. It did take some deliberate thought and planning to find the new healthier people.
I joined a women's support group, and my husband joined a men's support group. He resisted for a number of years, and then finally joined up and said "I can't believe I waited so long to do this, it's wonderful." You may not have those where you live - I live in a cruncht-granola area of the world - but I reckoned that a group like that would have healthier people, and it did.
I also looked into hiking groups, meet-ups, and hobby groups. The way I make friends, I needed a period of hanging out with the people and getting to feel comfortable with them before doing any one-on-one initiating, which I am just not good at. Some of my closest friends are now from those groups.
I'd suggest there might be two reasons this is an excellent idea for you, apart from the AW issue. One is that in Western culture often the woman of a couple is the "social organizer," as it seems to have developed in your case, which means that the man's social organizing skills get rusty. If the woman leaves, dies, is incapacitated, etc., he is high and dry. There is a big statistic of men who die soon after their wives die, because they don't know how to make social connections any more and the loneliness is a big stress factor. Obviously that's no good! You want your skills on form to make a happy life for you no matter what other people do or don't do.
The second reason is that when we hang around with unhealthy people, our sense of what's normal and healthy becomes skewed. My guess is that those A's are not actually very functional and healthy, although you're used to them by now. But they set the bar pretty low for healthy skills and interaction, I'd guess - my experience of alcoholics is that their ability to handle life and make good decisions is pretty darn terrible. We're inevitably affected by our social context, and so this is going to bring your healthiness down too - alcoholism sucks everyone into the insanity. Having some friends leading healthier lives can be a great influence.
That kind of lonely-feeling phase is where we sometimes fall back into same-old same-old habits. I applaud you for wanting to get out there and find new folks. It will be awkward and odd from time to time for a while, but they're out there.
I agree with a lot of what's been said but want to throw this two cents in - if you like some of the people at some of the gatherings, there is nothing preventing you from showing up in a separate vehicle, enjoying some socialization and then bowing out when you see things going a way you want to avoid. I have found that Al-Anon tools work when dealing with a variety of problem people or people problems and they allow me to be in the same vicinity as people I don't want to be with without missing out on the fun of seeing those I do like. An added benefit has been quiet private understanding conversations with a select few who "get" the reasons I may be absent AND who wish they had the strength/wisdom to do the same because THEY live with a problem drinker but never say anything.
Providing a perfect opportunity to pass it on!
-- Edited by likemyheart on Tuesday 2nd of June 2015 12:05:12 PM
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I am strong in the broken places. ~ Unknown
All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another! ~ Anatole France
I can remember when I first found recovery and was told that I'd probably need to avoid my former playmates and playgrounds. I was quite young and terrified.
There are open meetings (other side of coin) in my area on both weekend nights. Also, at the groups I belong to, there are often social events on the weekends. If you call your local support # (either side of the coin), they can tell you of any weekend activities.
I began to play softball again and also joined a gym. I was willing to let go of my past and try new things in anticipation of a different future.
It has worked for me. I rarely don't have something to do if I choose. It took some time and some reaching out for phone numbers and inviting others to coffee/lunch/dinner, but was worth it in the long run.
Try something new and/or different. Sign up to volunteer, join a charity walk, explore Habitat4Humanity, etc. Service work is a great way to meet like-minded people!!
Best to you - and ... if you feel you want to see the old friends, by all means go -- just take your tools and your HP and your own transportation.
Make it a great day!
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Hi almost there, I can truly identify with this share. When I first started program, I disassociated myself for my entire family of origin. I stopped going to Christmas and Thanksgiving dinners etc.
, To be perfectly honest, I don't even think they missed me but they always extended an invitation. When I began to feel strong enough to be around them because my Al-Anon tools were firmly in place, I began to go to Christmas dinners and Thanksgiving celebrations. They all knew my husband was in AA and had been in several rehabs over the course of many years-- to the day he passed away, they invariably offered him a beer or scotch on his arrival. Had I not had Al-Anon tools I would've really overreacted,, gone ballistic and created a crisis. Since his drinking problem , (thanks to Al-Anon and AA) was in his hands,he was able to refuse and ask for Coke. I kept my cool, kept the focus on myself and did not react.
To this day I still don't understand the disease of alcoholism but I no longer try to educate them. I stay detached, keep the focus on myself, validate myself, treat them with courtesy and respect and enjoy my visits.
I've also made other friends that do not drink, and I enjoy my time with them as well.
Take what you like and leave the rest
I'm not sure what's right for you, but I'll tell you what I did under somewhat similar circumstances. I joined a couple of Meetup groups centered around my interests (fitness related) and I started going to open AA meetings. I've made new, sober friends that way. Rarely am I lacking for something social to do, and alcohol isn't involved. It's a beautiful thing
Thank you all for the support. There are a lot of good take-aways in your replies.
I think the key for me at this time is recognition that, even though I am feeling better, I am still a complete novice at both learning and using the tools.
I don't want to jeopardize my progress.
After being with my A last weekend (without the gang) and having her start up the usual (I handled it well though - thanks al-anon!), I'm not ready to put myself through that just yet if I don't have to.
Plus, it would do me good to at least make some effort to look elsewhere before I resort to subjecting myself to the worry, embarrassment, discomfort, and likely testing of my skills, and oh yeah, the freakin' smell!
Thanks all! Time to end the pity party and be happier about being happier, even if it means some lonely nights!
-- Edited by almostThere on Wednesday 3rd of June 2015 12:34:54 AM
For me, having my own friends is super important. But when I think about it, I think it is more about "having my own gig" than having my own friends, because having your own "gig" actually brings your own friends.
I was always "somebodies something", if that makes sense. I mean, I was my parents child, then I was my husbands wife, then I was my kids mom.
Then, I got married to my second husband, still never having just been me, on my own.
I thought he would be my best friend, my partner. But his relationship with alcohol trumps his relationship with me.
So, I looked for something I could do with or without him. I am not trying to push him away, but I do not want to do drinking activities or things that include alcohol.
There are millions of geocaches all over the world, and I find that fascinating. It is fun, and there is an online community, you can go on your own, or with a group prearranged online. You can take your kid, or you can take your dog, and you never know who will be hunting the same one. You might meet a cool hunting partner.
You can hunt them, or you can hide them.
I hunted them in Las Vegas because it was more fun than sitting in a casino watching my drunk husband feed our money into a machine. Just a thought.
So, Friday night my A said she was going to some friends to visit as always and that I was welcome to come (Gee! Thanks for giving me your permission). I turned it down as usual and instead went to 2 meetings. I felt really good after and was in a good mood. She got home earlier than I expected and she wasn't too drunk surprisingly enough. I could tell that she wasn't quite sure why I wasn't irritated with her, and it caught her a little off guard. It was still kind of early and she asked me if I wanted to go up to the local watering hole - we haven't gone out together in months. I thought about it for a long time and finally decided I'd give it a go since things were less tense than usual. We went. I had one beer. She had 2 or 3. I wasn't counting and didn't care. There was music. She spent all night talking shop with a co-worker and I stood there by myself getting scoped out HARD by this attractive woman that I had a real hard time not talking to. A very strange evening. I feel like I'm halfway between married and single, but KNOW I'm not and could never step out. I enjoyed feeling attractive though. A generally uneventful evening - the first in a while. I'd probably have done just as well to stay home though. I felt just as lonely there with my wife.
