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I am starting a new thread after reading CarolinaGirl's response to Loupiness.
My daughter is 7 years old, last night I heard her express concrete evidence that she is affected by her Dad. She and I were getting ready to play with our dog in the backyard when AH started mumbling cr*p under his breath in the other room. She looked at me and said, "Just ignore him."
It's not that I didn't think she was affected by his behavior, but I go to such degrees to insulate her from his disease and to create stability in her life that I really don't know how much she gets. This has been part of her life forever so it is very hard to decide when she is old enough to have a conversation with her about the real truth...and what do I say to her when I think the time is right?
I think there are a lot of us who could benefit from hearing other member's experiences with helping our children understand and cope. Thanks, Babysteps
I have had my own children counsel me with the same kind of advice many times. It is a catch-22 no doubt. I want my children to love their father and yet I don't want them to follow in his footsteps. I want them to learn tolerance and compassion and yet I don't want them to enable. I want them to be respectful, and yet I don't want them to be blind to bad choices.
I have talked to my children openly since our family has started in recovery. My husband has been sober now for 10 months. My children and I openly discussion addiction and the problems thereof. They are 13 and 10 years of age.
A bigger problem I have is with my Grandchildren. My step daughter died a couple of weeks ago from an overdose of perscription drugs. her 4 year old and 9 year old were at home. The four year old clearly tells everyone that "mom died. She took pills and died." How do we deal with that? How do we help those children understand in light of social stigma? This is truly a tough question.
There is a CAL pamphlet titled "How can I help my children?" - might have some ideas.
I am personally grateful for everybody who talks openly and honestly with children. It tells them they're not crazy, they ARE seeing weird stuff, things are NOT hunky-dory, and no shame accrues to them for it.
Most of the problem with my A was between him and my oldest daughter (now 13). Much of the problem was that they would fight and he would say she said/did something and she would deny it. With his drinking/drug use and knowing full well he was solidly convinced that I had don't things I know I didn't do I was always put in a position of having to choose who to believe. I usually chose him because he was the adult and I regret that now. Just the other day she told me that he would ask her who do you think she's gonna believe? She said that's why many times she never bothered to tell me things that had happened when I wasn't home such as him leaving them all home alone with her while I was gone on business trips, coming home drunk and screaming at and hitting everyone. I know she was terrified of him and now wants nothing to do with him, the others are more forgiving. I see it as the natural consequence of his choices, if she doesn't want to see him she doesn't have to. The scary thing is that sometimes I think he really believes that he saw/heard something that just never happened and not just when he was using.
The way I have dealt with this is to be completely honest with them. If he's in jail they know he's in jail and that it's because of drinking/drugs. Most of the time it's just assumed so we don't talk about it too much anymore except as an example of what can happen if you drink or use drugs. The youngest doesn't really understand yet but when he is older he will know too.
One of the things that came with my recovering A was his 12-year-old daughter. He has full custody of her because her mom is an even bigger mess than he ever was. She's dealt with his problem all her life, from watching him deal to attending open AA/NA meetings with him during the two years he diligently worked his program.
Strangely enough, though, she seems woefully ignorant about his condition and what it all means. She thinks that when he's abstaining, his addition is "cured" and believes all his other negative behavior is just because he doesn't love her that much. I think a lot of this is due to her grandmother's (A's mom) influence. She is a hardcore enabler and criticizer, and the girl has spent a lot of time in her care when dad was struggling to get clean and relapsing.
Anyway, I've never been a mom before--and still am not technically--but I'm being completely honest and open with her about everything I know or learn as I get more involved in Al-Anon. I'm honest, too, about the things he "does wrong" without bashing him (Example: the other day he told her I decided she couldn't do something she wanted to do--even though I was OK with it--because he didn't want to be the "bad guy" and deny her wish. She ran to ask me why I wouldn't give permission, said what her dad told her, and I said, "well, he's lying." Simple fact.)
I also offered to take her to Alateen if she wanted, and she did attend her first meeting on Monday. She liked it a lot and wants to go to more. She wants her dad to go back to AA, too, but I keep reminding her that all we can do is go to our meetings...we can't make him go to his.
My A also has a 9-year-old son, but he only visits 4-5 times a year. Since A and daughter moved in with me, he's been for a week, but the subject of dad's problem never came up. I expect if it does, though, I'll be just as honest with him.
Hello babysteps , so good to see this post . Like most of us I thought I had protected our children from this disease too. Your daughter is 7 , Al-Anon printed a book called Whats Drunk Mama? for the pre teen , it is an amazing little book written with the younger kids in mind . It talks about having respect for alcoholic ,explains that this is a disease and reasures the child that they are not the problem . You may have difficulty finding this book as it is out of print now but perhaps your literature depot will have a few coppies left . If you attend f2f meetings ask the group rep or literature person to try and find you one. goodluck Louise
I have a 14 yo son and a 5 yo daughter. My AH is a crack addict/alcoholic. We've been married for 15 years.
I denied myself the truth about my AH's addictions for a really long time. Once I saw them for what they were, I tried to protect my kids from it. And I tried to protect their opinion of their father too. When he would stay out all night and for days and weeks at a time, I would say he was working or staying w/a friend or some other excuse.
I finally had to level w/my son a couple of years ago. He went w/his dad to run some errands and they ended up at a drinking buddy's house. When I finally tracked them down after they failed to show up and my in-laws' for dinner, I gathered up my son and took him home w/me. I got into a huge argument w/my AH about how I had no control over his drinking or him driving afterwards but I do have control over my son and he will NOT drink and drive our kids around. My son was so upset b/c he had been feeling like "One of the guys" and I ruined it for him. He saw me as the meanest mom in the world, a monster. That was night I leveled with him. Told him everything about his dad's drinking and drug use. I explained to him what could happen if his dad drove under the influence. And that I didn't know what his dad would do if he had the kids w/him when hit w/a crack craving. I didn't trust him not to take the kids w/him to the crack house. Or would he ditch the kids at someone elses house promising to come back and get them in a little while only to never show. I didn't know and didn't want to find out.
Life has been hard. But in the truth, my son has found some understanding. He did research at the library about drugs and alcohol and deals w/his dad's behavior better. I don't think he has quite learned detachment but he is better at it now that he used to be. As far as my daughter goes....well, she is so young that she wouldn't understand the whole truth. She knows that dad doesn't live w/us any more and is finally ok with that. Outside of that, that is all she knows. She learn more as she gets older I am sure.
My AH has been clean since mid July and doing well right now. Oddly enough, when he is doing well, that is when my son behaves at his worst. But we are still working on it. And will be for a long time.
Good post. Such a struggle for me! Sometimes I find myself absolutely speechless. Are the kids being affected by our family dysfunction? Absoultely, but at times I feel paralyzed in how to help. My 14 yr old is going to counseling. My daughter, 10, went once, but since we had just started our marriage program she was feeling happy and convinced the counselor there was no need. She refuses to go back.
The other mornng when my ah came in, he was furious at me. He was yelling some and trying to contain his anger by talking through his teeth. He was doing this while holding our 3 yr old.
That night ah comes in and scoops up the little one. Here it was 11 hrs later from the morning events and the first thing he says to his dad is, "You yelled at mommy this morning. Don't yell. Just talk".
Everyone commented on how smart he was. I think it meant a whole lot more than that! Ah has no ability to project at all as to how our actions today affect the future of our kids. At the same time, while I know many of my interactions are harmful, it is difficult to change and my kids are suffering. I am really going to put a lot of prayer and effort into this. I hope its not too late.
Blessings, Lou
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Sometimes what you want to do has to fail, so you won't ~Marguerite Bro~
