The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
First and foremost, my A and I split up 4 months ago after 7 years and the decision he made NOT to go to rehab.
So the other day I was shopping at Target with my kids, and I ran into this guy I knew from my 20's (20 years ago)....funny and cool, and then on the party scene in our city. He was at Target with his 2 little boys. We said hi...gave our updated vital statistics....both divorced, had our own businessess, etc....then exchanged email.
I got an invitation to dinner. Tonite. Great....but since the invite, that I accepted, we had been talking and it came to the surface that he battled alcohol/drug addiction and has been sober and working a program for 2 years. RED FLAG for me!
My thoughts are to take one day at a time....it's dinner. But my gut says, why bother? I'm not completely recovered in my program as a codependant.
I am nervous, as my A is still crying the blues and banging on my door occasionally. Last week I had to call the police.
I view alcoholism and alcoholics as all raving maniacs...is it fair to judge this person I met that way? I guess time will tell...I will tread lightly.
But any advice from those of you with recovered A's in their life would help.
I have not dated anyone who is recovery but I want to share anyway. My AH is struggling with sobriety. He goes to AA 2x per week and has a sponsor, but still stumbles at very regular intervals. We don't have a f2f Al-anon meeting nearby so I attend the open AA meeting with him (which is a wonderful experience every time and I encourage all al-anoners to go every now and then). Anyhoo. One thing that is emphasized in this meeting is that there is no such affliction as "alcoholwasm," the disease is "alcoholism." What they mean by this is that there is no such thing as a former alcoholic. Once and alcoholic always and alcoholic and the disease is a disease of relapse. I am not necessarily saying that all A's are damaged goods, but in my opinion 2 years of sobriety is not enough of a track record to guarantee that there will be no relapse. And, I personally would never ever ever date a person with a past or present addiction problem given what I have endured with my AH.
I don't know if any of this helps, take what you like and leave the rest. Good luck with your decision! Babysteps
He has a disease, will by all statistics, relapse.
He is still an A. I would not have anything to do with him. Not judging him, he is surely a perfectly nice person. But for me, I would not survive going thru it again.
My A came to me sober on program for years, money in the bank, great job, honest, trustworthy, sorta boring, but he was very good to me.
Well now he is homeless, dieing, has no job,no money, sold all his tools,lost his business. well he lost everything, even his toothbrush... he was a wonderful lover that turned into my feeling raped....
would I, NO WAY. I have a permanently disabled shoulder from being tossed hard into the ground....love,debilyn
Well!!!!!!! I have a bestfriend who I have known twenty years. He is in recovery six years. Has NOT relapsed. He is working his programme, to the best of his ability. We have moved the friendship a step further, we are now in a physical relationship. I only think of him as he has always been in my life. I do not or have not judged him. There is an old saying "Never judge a book by it's cover" and I think this applies in this post.
You have one life kicky, you are responsible for what goes on in your life. That means you have "Choices". It's okay to ask for wisdom. And it help us see things clearer. But one persons experience is different from the next.
Some people can be in AA a long long time and NOT relapse. Go with your gut feeling on this one.
I dated a sober A only once, and for a very short time. In fact, I doubt she was really sober. She was a psycho - which I find attractive.
I have been sober a while, but TBQH, I wouldn't date me. Not so much for fear of relapse, just because of who I am.
I would be uncomfortable in a relationship with someone who does not have an AA or Alanon program. We would not speak the same language. Not that having a common program is a guarantee we would. But at the same time, it seems that AA relationships have a high flop rate. Higher than average... way higher. That probably is just because we are alcoholics - sober or otherwise. We are not easy people to love... and sometimes it's even harder to love each other. Sometimes relationships lead to relapsees, or a breakup leads to a relapse. Or relapse leads to breakup.
I don't believe that a relationship by itself (or a breakup of one) can be the cause of a relapse. It can be an excuse for a relapse, but by itself is not a cause. What a relationship does is test our program - it places stresses on parts of our emotional and spiritual life that otherwise might go untested. If we are deficient in those areas, this can lead to relapse.
It's a tough test. I'm not sure I could pass. I'm not sure I want to try. I feel much of the time that I'm just doing fine being single, but being single doesn't make me immune to relationship stresses.
What I'm having trouble with right now, as I dabble with dating, is seeing the positive side of a relationship... or, the answer to the question "Why are you even looking?" I'm not sure. I have rejected almost everything that was good about my marriage. Or rather, those memories and feelings have been placed into the box labeled "suspicious". I don't trust feelings like that anymore, because of what happened - and because of what SHE said - that our relationship was a big lie. Does that mean everything that I perceived as good about it was all a lie, all an act on her part? Probably not, but - I'm stuck with that judgement of it. What else can I conclude? I just don't have enough alternative experience to compare it to.
The feelings I have for friends, my other family members - grandkids included - feel safe for me, because they don't involve the same level of trust that an intimate (i.e. sexual) relationship requires. I am very comfortable where I am - perhaps too comfortable. I'm definitely afraid of getting into a serious, intimate relationship again. That part of me was violated, and I am not only afraid of being violated again, but also afraid of passing on my own baggage. You can see why for the past decade plus, chosing the single and mostly celibate life has been an easy, comfortable, and serene - if cowardly -path.
I think this is such a difficult thing. Part of me screams out "no, just avoid the unknown" the other parts says "well you never know he could really be a great guy!" There are so many "what if's", but there are always "what if's" and we could kill ourselves (or become permanently immobile) due to "what if's". I think that if you do decide to go out with him go ahead and think of your boundaries. Tell him you understand he is in the program--working a program, but this is what you expect and if you see signs otherwise then you will ___ (whatever you decide). That way you aren't completely shutting the door, but he will know where you stand and maybe with that clarification you can better think about what you are willing to get into.
I don't know. It was just a thought. Good luck with this. Be careful. Take care of you and your kids.
If it's just dinner without expectations or fear then it might be a good time because the program is something in common. It's not likely that it will end up in a food fight or something like that.
You might want to talk to your sponsor before attending and go over your fears and the like just to get the picture and boundaries right.
I have dated people in recovery and it still always comes out to me taking my best program with me because often times the problem ain't with the person I am with but the person I am. Man could I get into trouble without intending it to happen.
I would be interested in how you proceed with this cause I am into solutions that I may not have in my bag tools yet.
As I read some of the great responses you got, one thing occurred to me. People will walk on your boundries from time to time, sometimes by pure accident. My issue is not with people doing that, but what they do when I let them know they have.
Do they have a fit and say I have no right to my boundries... (that's what I have now), or do they think about it and attempt to not do that again.
Program, no program, A or not .... any person who has issues with others boundries are going to be tough to live with.
Just a random thought.
Take care of you!
__________________
"Good judgement comes from experience... experience comes from bad judgement" - unknown
So much of this depends on your program and his - if both of you are really working at your own issues, this could work out. If one or both of you are just coasting, not really doing the hard work (working the steps, talking often and honestly with a sponsor, getting involved with service, making actual and concrete changes in your life) then it could be a disaster. You know about your own program, but you don't know anything about his. I would procede cautiously, and only if you really want to. The chances of you picking another bad bet are quite high, if you have not made some real changes to yourself through the program.
Thanks to all for wonderful insight. I did have dinner with him last night. I kept my program close in my pocket. He brought his to dinner as well. We had a perfectly lovely evening, talking, comparing parenting notes, movies, etc. He talked at lengths about his program and his sponser. He spoke about being grateful as well as humble. Of course the little "Fred Flintstone martian man" was sitting on my shoulder at times reminding me of the lies A's tell, BUT, I kept reassuring myself that the food and conversation where good. No boundaries were even approached. I worked my program, and he successfully worked his. Today he called me and asked me to have coffee. I went, same thing, lots of chemistry, lots of commonalities. Tonight, he called. He was leaving an AA meeting and having a bite to eat with some folks from his group.
So I think he's comfortable talking with someone on the otherside of the program. I'm thinking he knows I understand that he has a disease and because I work the program myself, I have the tools not to come in between him and his HP. For sure, I will not let him come between me and mine.
One thing great about the dinner experience , it totally kept my mind off the active A I threw out of my house 3 months ago. It was awesome being at a fancy dinner without worrying if an 8th glass of wine was going to be ordered...or the other people would start to stare at our table as the tone of voice got louder.
I don't know if this dinner will lead anywhere with this person. I think the experience helped my program in a big way.
