The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
I was just talking to a client of ours that is placed at a local treatment center in a receptionist position as a way to gain some work experience.
She was talking to us about this kid she met at the treatment center. He had come in to do an intake to start services there. He completed that and then had an appointment to come back. Well that night he got a letter from a local judge that stated that he was being sentenced to serve another 90 days in jail. Well his family, girlfriend, and friends proceeded to tell him what a piece of s**t he was and that he was worthless and a loser for going back to jail.
Well the kid hung himself that same night. Now he is gone and his 7 month old son will grow up without a daddy.
Yes he made some bad choices, but he took a step by going to the treatment center and asking for help. And yes putting the rope around his neck was his choice as well, but I can't help but think that his loved ones helped him tie the knot.
I am so grateful for this program and that I have been able to seperate my hubby from the disease. (At times I struggle with that. In fact just posted on the AA board regarding that very struggle.) I can not make him use, and I know that. My words our extremely powerful and can cut and do much more damage than I realize. I love my hubby and don't ever want to cause him the pain that I few hateful words can cause. I am not perfect, so sometimes I slip. But the reminders I am given by my HP are guiding me everyday.
Mandy
-- Edited by Dolphin123 at 17:20, 2006-06-30
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"Today's problems can not be solved if we still think the way we did when we created them" -Albert Einstein
Mandy: As someone who has been suicidal I do know that certain people's words towards me have had an undue influence on me. I have worked really hard to correct that to make the person who counts in my life be me. When I heard this story i did not immediately rush to judgement of his family I am sure they were burned out by lots of things. I think it is very sad that this boy/man was in treatment and yet could not reach out there. I also think it is sad that the staff were not aware of how fragile he was. I also think that our criminal justice system has much to be desired. For some people jail is the bottom for others it is the end.
I am reminded all the time how fragile life is for some of us and how overwhelming some things are. I feel overwhelmed every day on different levels. I have to remind myself things are better because my thinking can regularly persuade me this is the worst.
He had only been to the treatment center for 2 hours to fill out paperwork, that was his first visit. And the thing that shocked them was how happy he appeared to be that he had finally asked for help and was getting it. That was the night that he ended his life.
I know I do not know the family and what they went through. It upsets me because I have been with my "A" for 9 years and have shared his hell with him. I just know how he views himself, and how much of a loser that he calls himself. I don't need to add to that, I just need to focus on me.
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"Today's problems can not be solved if we still think the way we did when we created them" -Albert Einstein
I READ YOUR POST AND FOR SOME REASON IT STUCK IN MY HEAD-LET ME SAY RIGHT OUT--I DO NOT AGREE WITH YOUR ANALYSIS AND JUDGEMENT OF THIS YOUNG MAN'S "LOVED ONES" THERE IS A LOT MORE BEHIND A SUICIDE THAN WORDS JUST AS THERE IS A LOT MORE BEHIND AN ALCOHOLIC THAN JUST DRINKING. I FEEL FOR THIS YOUNG MAN AND HIS FAMILY JUST AS I FEEL FOR THE HUNDREDS OF FOLKS IN THIS AL-ANON GROUP THAT ARE IN CONSTANT BATTLE WITH TRYING TO DEAL WITH THE ALCOHOL IN THEIR LIVES AND HOPE TO COME THROUGH IT SANE.
I MEAN NO HARM TO YOU OR ANYONE-I JUST CHOOSE TO DIS-AGREE-I DO WISH THAT THE YOUNG MAN WOULD HAVE HAD A CHANCE TO SEE A PROFESSIONAL THAT MAY HAVE FOUND HIS PROBLEM IN TIME TO SAVE HIS LIFE...
This situation saddens me so much! My best friend's son who is currently selling meth has had so many hurtful things said to him by his dad over the years. Thank goodness my friend divorced him years ago, but his dad still goes on and on with mean statements. He has always said things like you will amount to nothing, You are going to end up in jail, you are no good, etc.
I have seen since he was very young how these words have influenced the way he is now. This dad has 2 college degrees etc. but is sick, sick, sick. Yes, he is an alcoholic too but that still is no excuse. I talked to him once years ago about how he talks to his son but as we know, we are powerless. I suppose alcohol and drugs have numbed this kids feelings and pain.
I too suffer from chronic depression and when I am vulnerable, words can have a huge impact on me. I am getting counseling and have for many years, yet it is no that easy to control sometimes. I really feel for this family and our hope can be that they learned from this. There are so many dysfunctional people in this world.
As a teacher, I would tend to give the so-called high risk kids extra TLC and give them positive words. This reminds me of bullying too that has caused kids to commit suicide.
Thanks for posting this. It is an eye opener for me and hopefully someone will read it that will realize to use tender, kind words to all. If you read my one post about husband's spitefull words, you will see how those pushed my daughter over the edge! Thank God she was able to reach out for help and is getting it in a safe home.
It seems this post hit a sore spot in me and my hope is people can try hard to be kind to others. cdb xoxoxoxo
Thanks for this post.My younger sister who is an A,and is married to a verbally and physically abusive A,has a son who has been into selling drugs and also drinks.I was at their home once for a family Thanksgiving dinner and my sister was on her son's back constantly trying to get him to drink.Another time,when the family moved my mom I heard my sister and her husband telling their son that he was useless and worthless and putting him down.The kid had brought a friend to help with the move and they were both working very hard.It just breaks ny heart the way they talked to him.
The son is estranged from both of them now.He married a nice girl,that my sister ablsolutely hates,and moved away from them.Last I heard he is not doing drugs or selling them and has cut down on the drinking.There had been a big fight and he had called my sister a very bad name.She was so devasted.Well, where did he learn it?He heard his dad talk to his mom like that all his life,not to mention the way they talked to him.I told his dad once that he should compliment his son when he does something good,and all he said was "he never does anything good", and laughed.
My mom and myself and even my AH always have tried to compliment the son and try to build him up whenever he got the chance.I doubt it was enough to undo what the parents have done.
This issue does also make me think of the way I talk to my AH.You know, in anger I think I have said I hate him, I have told him he is useless,worthless,selfish,cold.....God forgive me.I have put him down in my own sickness and rage.I am sure this is what is going on with my sister and her husband,they are so sick from the alcohol and hate themselves so much they do not know how to love their only child.
I cannot stand any form of child abuse,verbal or physical,but I am just realizing it is no better to verbally abuse a grown man who has a disease that is stronger than he is.He also was abused as a child,told he was stupid.My AH has never said the things to me that I have said to him in my rage.The worst he has said to me is that I am crazy,and he was right about that.( other than telling me he didn't love me any more and he loves the online girlfriend)
After the last anger rage fit I had, I came home from work and he had loaded the dishwasher and did laundry because he thought that might be why I was so upset.Then we had another fight that night with me screaming and ranting and the next morning he set his alarm just so he could get up before I left for work and give me a hug.
The rages have to stop.I am going to make an effort toward this.
Thanks ((((dolphin))) for putting this out on the world wide web.Mybe it will reach others who can start to love rather than abuse. d
Hi everyone... Just joined.. this is my first post/respose..
This is very interesting for me.. well ..
I am an alcoholic... (hate to admit that).
I have been drinking pretty much every night since i was about 17-18 and im gona be 30 towards the end of this month.
I dont know how long exactly but for atleast 3 years now my mum and dad have been gettin drunk every night too. Cos of my drinking etc i still live with them so i see it every day.
I hate the fact my mum n dad drink, i just want to tell them to stop and call them sad pathetic losers!! I hate it.. i see them drinking and see how f**k**g pathetic they look and i often feel i despise them when they are like that.. i just hate it so much to see them like that.. even today... talking to dad when he had been drinking, i kept looking away so i didnt have to see his half closed eyes and try to blot out the slur in his words. I just wana yell at them and tell them to stop being so f'ing pathetic.. Its the emotion - anger and frusrtation coming out. Drinkers, including myself, spend most the day trying to clear their throats cos of the phlem build up... and my mum n dad are constantly making such noises.. and it drives me nuts.. infact i know my dads noises drive my mum nuts too. I am a total hypacrit cos i am probably more a drunk than them and hav been drinking alot as such alot longer than they have..
Anyway...
I feel so bad for both the boy who killed himself and his family too. Even though they contributed to his tragic end.. I know what its like to wana verabaly abuse someone you love cos of they drinking... You feel angry towards them for making you feel as you do.. You blame them for hurting you.. cos you love them and dont wana see them in so much pain and hurthing themlselves SEEMINGLY WILLINGLY!!..
As iv said i have been drinking alot longer than my parents and iv put them through soo much over the years.. .. Yet i still feel anger and resentment to them for their drinking..
My point being.. i understand how much we can want to hurl abuse and demoralise those we love for doing something so obviously stupid.. We care about them yet they hurt us so much by hurtin themselves in a seeminly choice fashion. Its out of our control but not out of theirs ergo its their fault...
Very easy to feel that way... Though i understand this is a disease that makes us want it so badly so how can i really say its the boys fault.. He has a choice but its not an easy one.
Obviously i can see the poor boys perspective.. Especialy as he was trying to make it work.. I hate the fact it was the judges decision that caused the verbal comments from the family.. Such a shame for all...
Sorry if this post seems abit disjointed, edited it a couple of times.
Thank you so much for writing this! I know he probably put his family thru a lot but I cannot understand kicking someone when they are down (especially when they are trying to pull themselves back up!). This strikes a cord with me b/c of what just happen to us: my AH just admitted he is an A (got his chip Thur night for 30 days sober). He called his mother and told her he is an alcoholic and is going to AA. She made fun of him for going to AA b/c if he "just had enough faith in God" he wouldnt need to drink. She also called AA "tree huggers". She then spent the next 20 minutes telling him what a huge diappointment he is (and I am too) to her and listed all of his failures in the past 12 years. (how long we've been married). He is a very successful man at the power co and has his own business...she's had nothing to be ashamed of for those 12 years....I guess til now. Words DO kill if not physically, then spiritually and emotionally. He says she's "always been this way" and he's "not letting her bother" him but after all she IS his mother and it is obvious it does bother him. O his dad died 2 years ago and she told him of the times he "disappointed" his father too. AH has no way of knowing if that is true (dad never acted like anything was wrong!) and if so, making amends. I am so happy I found this site, I really needed to see this today and maybe others, by reading this topic will realize, words mean things, words can encourage and words can hurt.
I dont know if im hiding from the truth myself. IM scared that i let my parents down. I wonder if my dad sees me and is ashamed... or atleast dissapointed.. i know they love me to bits.. but i cant help but think.. Well if im honest.. what dad would want his son sat at home most nights gettin drunk when most guys are out having fun, doing stuff, dating girls, buying a house starting a life for themselves..
The other night, i didnt drink ..infact i had 3 days sober this week untill thursday. Me and mum had a heart to heart tuesday night . Omg what a night.. .. I drank so much last sunday that i was too ill to go to work monday, spent most the day in bed feeling awful.. didnt drink monday went back to work tuesday. Tuesday after work i went fishing. Got a call about 10 oclock just as i was packing up.. it was my mum.. shed obviously had a drink i could tel that. it was .. she sounded really .. low... she asked me if i was ok and waht i was doing.. I was all on the defensive and was like WTF? I thought she was being silly.. a 30 year old (almost) man and his mum is worrying cos hes not home yet ya know.. So i go home, kinda p'd off. Get home to find mum lying on the sofa crying her eyes out.. Long story short.. She thougth that perhaps cos of my situation and cos of her and dad and cos i had been off work the day before and cos i had come in and kissed her on the cheak before leaving that i was out commiting suicide and that i wasnt coming home, that i couldnt take it.. Infact i was having a great night fishing and untill her call i was on a real high.
Anyway we gad a real heart to heart, i told her that i had been to a few AA meetings and that i wanted to get back to them, havin not been for about 8 weeks or more. Anyway gettin back to my point, sorry if dont mean to hijack thread. Wednesday night after i had been fishing again i got home, mum had been drinking but wasnt off her face, she was reading. We spoke and as i was leaving the front room she said she was sorry if she let me down... initial i was gona say dont be silly etc.. then had a sudden realisation.. and just looked at her and said..."im sorry for letting you down..." and we kinda nodded at eachother as if to say we had both let eachother down but we were both sorry.
I told my mum tuesday night that i sometimes worry it was because of me and my drinking that caused her and dad to start gettin drunk every night.. She told me it wasnt me, that she could rem what started it and it wasnt me. But im not totaly convinced.
Anyway, as i said i didnt mean to hijack thread, it just took longer to explain my point.
Yes words can kill. But we all have choices to make. Sometimes the pain no matter where it comes from feels so unbearable. I feel sorry for this young man and his son. It is too bad the people living with A's can't see past their mistakes.
I am so glad you wrote this because I am feeling extremely resentful to my A and if I had not read this I may have said some things I would regret. I need to remember I am powerless over my A and his choices are just that..his.
