it's hard not to take inventory when... - Al-Anon Family Group

bobump · ~*Service Worker*~

it's hard not to take inventory when...

Dolphin123 · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Bob,

Honestly, she is an "A" and you don't feel ready for her to come home yet. For me that would be reason enough. For the most part I think we have good instincts, and should use them.

You are protecting your children, and they need that. They need to feel safe at home. If I found out that my "A" gave our children smokes or alcohol, he would be out so fast his head would be spinning. My children have inherited the disease of alcoholism, and I know they have to choose to pick up their first drink, but heaven help the person who encourages it.

Your thinking, to me seems very reasonable. When and if you are ready to have her return home, you'll know.

Hope that helped.

Much Love,

serendipity · ~*Service Worker*~

i agree with the above. only you know how it is and you can only do what you think is best. maybe it's easier for women to say"because that's the way i feel" and have others respect that or not queston it. follow your instincts. check your motives and then do the next best thing. as much as it stinks to be the only parent we are and we have to do for our kids what is best for them. even a bad example is an example. you are doing it and for that you are heroic! good luck and much love

Maria123 · ~*Service Worker*~

GULP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Bump (tee hee),

Here's my two cents. If you keep focusing on her inventory, my dear, you are going to lose your serenity. Remember keep the focus on you.

What is the status of your marriage etc? Are you going to leave? Are you going to stay? Are you going to ask her to leave? If you are ready for those kinds of questions, perhaps a court-appointed guardian-ad-litem can intervene here. A guardian can often objectively decide what's best for your children. Your objectivity may be clouded. Ya think?

For me, as a child growing up in an A home, I so wished my Mom had shown my Dad (the A) the door. She expended so much energy on him, his issues and his drinking that she had no reserves left for us, the children. I don't know if she knew about Al Anon but she certainly never attended any meetings if she had.

My life with my own children had been tipped upside down back in early 2000 and the one thing I know for sure, my children never wanted to be put between me and their Dad. Ever hear the old saying "it's ok for me to castigate Mom, but don't you dare say anything about my Mom." Even if she's an A, untreated or not, they love her. When moms and dads begin cutting down the other parent for positioning purposes or not, it destroys the self-esteem and inner core of our children's being.

You've got some tough decisions to make my friend. First you have to decide what you want to live with the rest of your life. Then if you are happy and are in a happy home wherever that may be, your children will live in a happy home, not walking on cracked eggs, not seeing their parents take pot shots at each other, etc. etc. etc.

As always, we are here for you and love and support you. Keep attending meetings, my friend. HP in his infinite wisdom will show you the path that you need take and as Robert Frost would say sometimes that path is the path less trodden: http://www.bartleby.com/119/1.html

I don't give advice unless asked and of course you can take what you liked and leave the rest.

love Maria

twinmom2 · ~*Service Worker*~

(((BoBump)))

Its hard to keep the focus on ourselves when all of this stuff is going on. I agree that asking yourself what you are willing to live with and what you aren't willing to live with is a good start. I'm sorry your children are going through this too. It's tough when they suffer and it comes out in unhealthy ways. I can tell you from experience with the Child welfare system in Florida that if she has been court ordered to complete services she has a choice. Remember the case worker's just want to push the cases along as fast as they can. They send kids home that don't need to go home, your kids have you and that is a blessing. A Guardian or Child Advocate may help if you can petition the court to appoint you one. Here in Florida we don't have enough volunteers so they save the Guardians for termination of parental rights.

Best thing to remember is that you are protecting the children by keeping the A out of the home. If she is unable to look honestly at herself and get help, then the behaviors won't change and the damage to you, the kids, and her will continue. Once you have figured out which way you want your marriage to go then you can think about what are my rights legally. Just from experience you have a good legal case. CPS courts would approve supervised visitation but may not approve reunification in the home. Spend a short time each day putting all this into perspective and then spend the rest of the day focused on you and your well being. The child welfare system is daunting and so many people get sucked into the games and he say she say that they cannot focus on anything for a year or at least until its all over. Good Luck, everything will work out for the best.

Hugs,

Twinmom~

Christy · ~*Service Worker*~

(((bumpers)))

I understand your concerns with your A. The focus can't be only on you when you have kids to protect. And I do think you do a great job of focusing on yourself and your recovery.
That being said...
I think I'd print off what you wrote and save it for whomever ..dfs, her psych, a lawyer etc.
Do what your heart and mind knows is best for you and your kids..

((big squeeze))
Christy

Ria · Senior Member

((((bobump))))

I feel a little uncomfortable offering my opinion but as you asked and I care, I will venture it. Please take what you like and leave the rest. I can't contribute much as I don't have children and have not walked in your shoes, however I was affected by dysfunction in my childhood home. Put quite simply, your wife is an A and wants to come home for her own reasons. It sounds like she is using whatever she can to secure that outcome for herself. At this stage it doesn't sound like she is overly concerned about the impact on your children and yourself. She is still unwell and recovery takes time. If you don't feel she is committed to her own recovery and that her presence in the home would not be in your childrens best interests then I think I personally would be inclined to trust my instincts. You don't have to say "Never!", just "Not now." It's a day at a time and things can change. There could also be a 'battle of the wills' in the making as she clearly said "Nobody can make me do what I don't want to do". She may be resentful and perceive you not allowing her back into the home as 'exerting your power' and 'forcing' her to do what she doesn't want to do ie: live away from home and be responsible for herself. If she doesn't want AA at this stage her chances of good recovery are more slim.

Sadly, as the responsible parent you have to do what you think best to protect your children from further damage and provide a safe, loving and nurturing environment. It's a tough call but if your wife is afraid or her security is threatened it is likely that she will be self-centered and manipulative as her fear will force her old (and at this stage, most natural) behaviours to the forefront. I do not say this unkindly, if she is an A, she will do what A's do. Only you know the full details of your personal situation and yes, IMHO it is your responsibility to consider your options and calculate your position in order to be a pro-active parent. Please be careful you don't start obsessing or lose your focus. I would suggest you give yourself a set period of time each day to assess or evaluate the situation as objectively as you are able and then try to get on with the rest of it as best you can.

You are doing fantastically well in very difficult circumstances. I hope that wasn't too 'brutal'. Know that I care and wish you well.

x Maria x

kitty · ~*Service Worker*~

"She told her sister, "I'm not going to AA, nobody can make me do anything I dont' want to do." That is true but I don't have to continue to accept this behavior." - Bob

Well, while I understand that you may feel guilty for 'taking her inventory' as it were, I also recall you were asked to make a pro/con or "expectation" list for your counseling. B4 I got married, we did the same thing... expectations about who will do what (chores as such), that u expect fidelity, to be able to talk to each other, et cetera.

I didn't realize (as love is SO BLIND! - UGH) that I was going from addictive family household, right into another addicitve atmosphere & that my ex husband was lying to the Priest, to make things sound great for him, too perfect to be real.

IMHO & w/ my ESH... I think you have very real & legitamite concerns ~ bad enough to influence or manipulate adults but minors - I think they have laws against that & w/ proof she could end up in jail, not merely a treatment facility or even, open at large.

Not only are u protecting the kids but you are protecting yourself. I know some of the meds she was on (previously) & w/ alcohol withdrawl... not sure what is up w/ her 'not remembering' ~ I do know you can tend to sleep a lot or a lot less but that period shouldn't last very long.

Only you can tell you what is "right for you & the kids" and you are being a great dad. It is unfortunate she is blaming 15 yr old, saying she's lying; telling son not to talk to you & coaching daughter what to say to "get out" w/out getting help. To me that IS ALL very disturbing.

No, I do not think you are taking her inventory, it sounds like u are trying to objectively face the facts & see the forest.

With all of the physical fights, the OD's, the cutting... your family is progressed & in a serious state. The fact that she can 'know what to say "to get out" to the physicians, def makes me question that she is no longer in treatment & as you said above, doesn't appear to be interested in trying.

Don't be so hard on yourself & don't blame yourself... I know it is hard as we try to carry the guilt, since they are telling us so much, but it IS her problem & you are seeking help for you & yours.

Even sober ppl, lie, so I don't trust A's - I know they are the most manipulative & self serving ppl in the world. As much as I love them, I know better than to tell my true feelings or to believe them, count on them to follow through on their word. Even if they do keep a promise, I don't get my hopes up that they are "changed forever."

As u know (Bob) my ex while we lived together for 1.5 yrs was one way, nvr raise his voice, was considerate, wrote me loving notes, attended to me ~ got emotional information out of me -- I thought we were best friends. Turns out he used everything I ever told him about me, my family problems against me, which wounded me & cut me to the core greatly.

And on our 2nd day on our honeymoon - he turned into "his true self" & became verbally abusive, psychologically he tormented me & screamed at me from morning to night for over 4 yrs. Wow, talk about guilt keeping me there & determination that I would last in my marriage ~ it nearly killed me. Talk about stubborn & having my blinders focusing on the wrong thing.

I think it is "ok" to be aware of what is going on w/ the significant other, it is only when we NEVER focus on us, that it is a problem & we get lost... I see you focusing on yourself, working your Program & protecting your family, you have to to it a bit, to create the boundaries in the 1st place.

I am grateful, I realize I am a very loving person & have a lot more strength than I ever figured. I just wasn't giving it to myself, I was focusing on THEM, 38 years down... the rest of my life to go.

Hey, just work your steps, ppl get so hung up on step 4, I have done it so many times... each time you re-work it, you find new things for step 4 anyways.

Be honest with yourself & your support - the dyfs, the Dr's, everyone you are talking to on behalf of this difficult situation you are rising out of. There is a lot on your plate, you are being responsible & getting help, I'm so proud of you & will always be here for you & love you buddy!

love, your sister in recovery, -K

p.s. You deserve kudos & hugs, hand in there, one moment at a time, you are really doing great!!! (I know it doesn't always feel like it but you really are!).

aunitedway · ~*Service Worker*~

agree that you should seriously consider to show this paper (facts/notes) to those professionals that need to see * what is in your mind, your thoughts. The WAY You see it. What you are witnessing (from the (husband) *your point of view.) can only help them ( the decision makers) to understand more clearly your concerns for your children and yourself. And for you AW.

You're only trying to care for yourself , For your children, in the best and the most healthiest way you know how. I commend you and your loving efforts and most of all your patience and constant attempt at understanding.

Your doing great! Hang Tough!!!LOVE (((((((((((BIGHUG)))))))))))

((((((((((((((BO Bump)))))))))))))) your in my thoughts and prayers.

maresie · ~*Service Worker*~

I don't know what your wife's diagnosis was when she was in the hospital. I would think it went beyond alcoholism didn't it. I don't really get the gist of what treatment she is going to. The thing is she is going ot some. I guess the issues are many. I think it takes a long time for some people to want sobriety. I think it takes even longer to get over certain charactor traits like being maniplative, lying (especially as in your wive's case she has been schooled to lie in denial most of her life) and more. Sometimes a suicide attempt can do that. Other times people move out of a suicide attempt to blaming others. I can understand why she wants to come home because then she could be in even more denial. I can understand your need to keep the issues of her substance abuse front and foremost.

I can also understand that your wife's behavior, the drama around it, the continual issues with your daughter and other manifold issues of just surviving mean that you do not get to work on your own issues of codependence and your own issues in dealing with living a life as a child with a mother who was dysfunctional. I know for me as a recovering adult the fact that I had to become uncomfortable with things that were previously second nature to me has been incredibly difficult. I live next to a family who are tremendously chaotic. When I first lived here their actions did not bother me as much. Now they really bother me and I have much apprehension around certain times of year when they act out more (on certain public holidays).

I know for me as a people pleasing, codependent it has been tremendously difficult to let go of wondering what others think of me and wondering how to appear ok and really almost super human effort to set my own limits. I had to as a child look outside of myself for reality, I had to shut down as a child because my life was on continual overwhelm. As my sponsor puts it I learned to set aside myself, so it is not suprizing I ended up with people who had their own tremendous issues (like my current boyfriend). Do I take on people who have tremendous issues now, no. But I had to become super boundaried in order to stop being overly concerned with what others think, what others are doing, and what others are thinking about me. Personally I think the whole issues of setting limits, being with the limits, honoring the limits, setting boundaries and giving up people pleasing has been one of the most difficult I have ever encountered.

Maresie.

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