Another .. big big hugs .. i'm so sorry this feels so oppressive. The loved ones of an addict are collateral damage of the disease and they suffer as well. One thing that seriously bothers me about the system in place is that the families of the addicts suffer the system. My oldest and dearest friend .. her ex ah .was a hot mess still is .. everytime he got in trouble she was the one figuring out how to feed 6 kids and where they would live .. in the meantime he was getting 3 squares. As far as religion .. ...i'm gonna have to disagree with you regarding the religion. My sponsor was very devout catholic and she divorced .. had she wanted to get married .. ..she would have .. that's a bridge you neither have to cross or worry. I would encourage you to get a sponsor. You are not without your own choices. You don't have to leave .. that's a personal choice no one else can make. The safety issues bother me for you. Please do make sure you have a plan in place. You aren't alone and it gets better regardless if the alcoholic is drinking or not. Big hugs .. stay close here for support. S :)

I hear you, and I get it. I felt very much the same way when my wife wanted -- then demanded -- to keep "everything" between us. That said, while I hear you and I get it, please clarify for me what you mean when you say we have to deal with this silently in our community. What do you exactly mean by that? Compelled to continue the silence...and so the shame is perpetuated? I don't see it that way at all, however, I want to make sure I get complete clarity around what you are saying.

Where is your acceptance in all of this? You say you are powerless to stop him, and we get that, intellectually. However, it is far more than an intellectual statement that brings about a change in our thinking, mindset, etc. What are you afraid of when he comes home drunk? Him being abusive? What have you done about that? Nothing changes if nothing changes. No offense, but praying, giving concerns to God, etc. -- sure, that will get you to a certain point, but look at the steps...there is more. We have to do something. We have to take action. OK, so you've done that -- plan a, b, and c. Yet, it sounds like everyone's entire lives, their being, is all centered around and designed to accommodate the alcoholic. Again, nothing changes if nothing changes.

Your conclusion of a lesser sentence, while perhaps that is rationalizing and true in your country, it is not absolute, nor accurate, nor true in the US. Regardless, I don't get the point. Are you justifying that the drinking deserves a lesser sentence? In alanon we learn that we don't have to accept unacceptable behavior. In my experience, I learned that -- and this is just me -- I didn't have to tolerate the intolerable. I didn't come to alanon to learn how to make the unbearable bearable. That's just me though. Others "take what they like and leave the rest" and they use the alanon program for what they need and want.

I understand your feelings and belief regarding divorce. However, is it not because of all of your feelings, how you are handling this -- isn't all of that bringing you to where you are -- that you feel everything is weighted in your alcoholic's favor? Is it unfair because of him? What is your role in things being/feeling unfair? What is your contribution to that?

What do you feel will balance your thinking? A different perspective? A different way of looking at this? Perhaps this is a discussion you should be having with your sponsor, who knows you and your situation better than anyone. Your sponsor can be objective, which is perhaps something that is really missing from this.

All the best.

-- Edited by Bo on Tuesday 23rd of October 2018 08:33:43 AM

Sounds like you have a lot of ideas keeping you trapped. Alanon meetings and readings can set you free of this. You don't have to live this way. After a while in alanon we are free of this. The thinking and the feelings. The God i have in my life wants nothing but joy happiness and freedom for me. Maybe getting to know another God would help too.

Hello A Nother,

Thank you for describing this awful quandary so well - I too had the 'sickness and in health' quote swirling in my mind and yes, it did seem utterly unfair and explosive. I remember when I started asking myself some of these questions, it wasn't easy, but sitting with them really helped me to figure out that I did have options, even within my own framework. It felt like someone up there wanted me to keep learning!!

One of the things that struck me at my first Al Anon meeting was the palpable feeling of care and love in the room. I realised that I missed those feelings. There was one lady in particular who did not look tired, run down or unhappy, instead she glowed with health and happiness and yet it was clear that she too lived in our challenging world of alcoholism. How was that possible?? I wanted to be able to laugh like she did, to not worry about absolutely everything all the time. I wanted to figure out how to change me, or rather to get the old me back, so that I could have whatever it was she was having !!!

"Take what you like and leave the rest" felt like a good starting point and I applied it to my life as well as to the advice I was seeking.

My AH's drinking created problems for me. Did I really have to pick up all those problems? Were there some issues that I would be better off simply ignoring so that I could find some time in my day to be me? Our relationship was very out of balance, so how could I redress that balance so that I didn't turn into the resentful old fool that I thought I was becoming? I figured that if I continued to dwell in misery it wouldn't make any difference to me if AH ever stopped drinking, I would be completely exhausted and drowned in misery and impossible to live with anyway.

Perhaps because I tend to care more about others than I do for myself it felt easier for me to decide to practise good care of myself for the benefit of those around me - yes, this could be interpreted as a rather codependent approach, but it didn't do any harm to fool myself a little if I could make it work for me!! I wanted to be in a good place when my husband stopped drinking. My negative angry moments were sometimes accompanied by the thought "I'll show you..." so rather than indulging my desires for AH to feel pain (there, I admit it!!) I thought I would "show him..." by letting as much fun and enjoyment and pleasure into my life as possible. I resolved to "teach him..." by example. Obviously he wasn't engaged enough to see these lessons, but boy, did I start learning and they did me the world of good!!!!

I chose to dwell in a better place, I worked hard at it, and I did it regardless of what my alcoholic was choosing to do. I remembered things that I enjoyed when I was younger and reintroduced some of these things into my life; I spent time with friends; I learnt to play; I'm even in the process of learning to rest!! I walked away from rude and unkind behaviour and I was too happy and too busy to pay it much attention anyway - I had better things to do. Instead I was walking, guilt free, towards things that celebrate this amazing thing we all call life.

I'm so grateful to that marvellous lady at my first Al Anon meeting - I never met her again but I think of her very often. I sometimes wonder if that is how angels like to work in our world?!

The fact is that the whole thing simply is not fair.  That's definitely true.  Unfortunately "fair" isn't how many things operate in life.

That said, some things about the way you describe this are unchangeable (for instance, you can't change whether he drinks), and some are rules that come from various sources.  And as the saying is, Nothing changes if nothing changes.

I myself don't see why we would have to be silent about this huge aspect of our lives.  The alcoholic certainly likes us never to tell anyone what's going on - that's to his advantage.  It's all part of the big denial and pretending everything's hunky-dory.  But there's also an AA saying: You're only as sick as your secrets.

When I started to be authentic about what was happening in my life, I found a lot of friends also had experience with alcoholism in their families.  It was very freeing.  Of course I didn't just blab to anyone, because some people won't have helpful reactions.  I didn't want or need blaming or "Just do this and it will be fine" or people who just levy advice as though no solutions had ever occurred to me.  But I felt perfectly entitled to tell anyone I wanted to about what happened with the alcoholism.

Everyone makes their own judgement about divorce and how all that works.  I know that for many centuries, including the centuries that are regarded as the most religious, married people often lived apart from each other for various reasons.  Living separately is not the same as divorce.  Sometimes I would say it is absolutely necessary.  Surely no church wants people to live with violent spouses, and I believe nearly any priest would agree with that.  Not saying that your spouse is violent, just that there is judgement always involved in these things.

It is also important to bring up children in a way so that they feel safe and so alcoholism is not normalized - or they will find it familiar and repeat those patterns.  I think it's always a good question for us, whether we would want a relationship like ours for our children.

Hope you will dive into the program and take good care of yourself.

Hi there Im sorry to hear youre feeling this way and I can certainly relate to some of it. What is different for me is that I am not in a situation where I am dealing with abuse which makes safety your number one concern. So take what you like and leave the rest especially if it affects your safety. In my home many similar things were going on. Ive been in the program for 4 years and through working the program I learned how to take the focus off him and put it on myself and my child. The program has helped me build up my self esteem and sense of self worth to stop accepting unacceptable behaviour. And Ive started living my life around my desires instead of his. I have a loving supportive higher power. Practically this means I started using the phrase please dont speak to me that way I dont deserve it and meaning it. I started thinking less about what hes doing to ruin my life and more about what I can do to improve my life and my childs. Planning fun activities for us in the evening and on the weekend getting things we need done accomplished. I even go to the gym regularly and take her with me. I learned in the program that whatever I focus on will get bigger. So I try to focus on the things I want to get bigger like my joy and peace and happiness and I try to limit focusing on my frustration and unhappiness. And I know this is what my higher power wants for me too. My AH hasnt quit drinking but hes quit a lot of his bad behaviour while drinking. Hes pulling his own weight in our household because I have asked him to. He treats me with respect because I expect it now. My home is a lot happier and healthier despite his tendency to drink. We still have to change plans if his drinking is interfering with our plans but my life is so much better. I struggled with wanting to leave and wanting to stay. I can now clearly say I choose to stay because I love him and there is still a lot of good left between us. But I take our marriage one day at a time. With the freedom to leave if I cant do it anymore. Whatever you do I hope you find peace and some happiness for yourself and your children. We are here for you.