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so few anwers in my head. I feel like the insanity of being married to an A is coming back.
I need to ask....what is considered unacceptable behavior?
what do you tell the A who exhibits unacceptable behavior?
My A keeps making empty promises about EVERYthing, not just his drinking, ie, 'I'm going to work on the house this whole week I'm off', 'I won't drink that much as I'm not as stressed'
I don't trust this person anymore, drunk or sober. How do I tell him he needs to either shut up with his promises or walk the talk?
Why do I feel like maybe it IS just me, because A can hold down a job, is quite intelligent, works out on a regular basis?
what are common boundaries? I've told him if he drinks he needs to sleep in a different room, because I have two small children and need my sleep. He snores horribly when he drinks and I can't wake him up to roll over.
Am I showing my children it is acceptable to be an alcoholic, by accepting his alcoholism?
I want nothing to do with him the day after he drinks and acts stupid, but he is all lovey giving me kisses and hugs. It makes me look like the cold b*tch. why do I feel this way?
WHO can I talk to about this??? It seems with meetings, it's about sharing success, and not about asking questions or being stumped.
...Am I showing my children it is acceptable to be an alcoholic, by accepting his alcoholism? ...
I've never anything phrased quite like this. I'm an alcoholic in recovery and accept that I have a disease. What if you were to replace 'diabetic' or 'cancer patient' for the word 'alcoholic'? Are you implying that it is any more UNacceptable to be an alcoholic than to have diabetes or cancer?
I think what we need to look at is the behavior caused by the disease and not the disease or the diseased person himself. My behavior when drinking was certainly not acceptable quite a bit of the time, but it was not by choice or by a weakness in character. To me this is the key to detachment when dealing with an alcoholic who is suffering.
I totally get what you are saying. In a way I think you are correct that living with an alcoholic teaches your children that this is OK behavior. My dad was an A...he treated my mother like crap and told us all the time how much he hated his kids etc. I married 3 A's before I fugured out the common denominator was me! I don't buy the line that it is the same as being a cancer patient. My whole family are alcoholics and I myself have also abused alcohol in my life. Sobriety is a choice and drinking is a symptom of the disease. The behaviors when drinking are almost always unacceptable. Have you ever heard this? How do you know when an alcoholic is lying? When their lips are moving? You cannot control the lies but you can control how you respond to them. You also feel like the cold b---h because of your part in this family disease. It makes you irritable and hard to live with. The rest of the family is relieved the A is happy and you are just sick of them. The whole family dynamics are screwed up when an active A is in the picture. I got really tired of the it's all about me attitude. Even in sobriety I find that aspect disheartening.
IKO--OH, Hon--I so understand what you are asking and going through!! I'm not sure if I have any good answers for you, but I am going to share what came into my mind.
As far as what is unaccepptable as unhelpful as it is I think that is totally up to you. It is what you can handle and what you are willing to live with. Can you handle him drinking in front of the kids, or driving while drunk, you have to decide what you can put up with and then what you can't put up with make a boundary for that. You're not trying to control him, but you are trying to make your life more enjoyable.
As far as what you say to an a exhibiting unacceptable behavior I personally don't think you can do much in the moment except hold up your boundary. You may have to do more removing of yourself and children than to confront him with it because confronting may just lead to a big arguement--in which case nothing will come of it. I think it's best to truly address it at a time when he is sober (for a minute).
The Lying--I hate lying!!!! I have found that I have to put up with more lying now than I ever thought I would have to. I have gotten to a point where I really don't expect him to do anything he says he is going to do. Is it disappointing--very!!! I also try to keep myself from asking him questions where the only choice he has is to lie to me. Now you and I as regular people would say well they have another option---to tell the truth. I honestly don't think they see that option!!! Even if I do ask a question I try to remind myself--he lies, it's just what he does. When he tells me he is going to do something around the house I become pleasantly surprised when he actually follows through!!! When he doesn't follow through, sometimes I point it out to him, others not it really depends on my mood. For the most part he knows he doesn't pull his weight in the relationship---that leads to guilt which leads to him feeling like he is no good which just helps his cycle continue to go around and around. I read in Getting Them Sober there is nothing we can do to hurt them as much as they hurt themselves! While I hate the lying right now I see that as just a part of it. There may come a time that I have absolutely had and just don't want to put up with it anymore, if that day comes I will deal with it!
My a isn't drinking anymore--now he is just using drugs. At this point he doesn't come home high. When he was drinkiing I tried to make sure the kids understood that drinking was making him sick. I didn't like the drinking, but he was an adult and he had to make his own decisions. I let them know that I didn't agree with daddy, but he had to make his own decisions, even though I didn't like his decisions all of the time I still loved him. Yesterday we had a daughter have teeth work done. She was told not to drink soda--so she was trying to think of what she could drink with supper. My a said I don't care what you have as long as it isn't soda--you can have beer if you want. She looked at him and "No Way, I don't want to get sick!!!" He just looked at me and smiled. I laughed--I thought that was pretty wise thinking for an 8 year old. (sad that she already has to think like that, but I'm hoping that saves her life!)
I know this is long and I'm not sure if it has been beneficial to you or not. I just want you to know you definitely are not alone.
Maybe someone else can give you something great to use. Hang in there. We can do only what we can do!!! WE are human and we can just try our best.
Lou, I wanted to reply to you. No, I wouldn't be unaccepting to the cancer patient, IF the cancer patient recognized the help needed and sought it out. this specific alcoholic denies there is a problem, much less a disease and refuses to seek help.
I don't see many breast cancer patients saying...'I DON'T have cancer....now I'm going to smoke myself silly.'
So I don't know if I buy the whole, cancer patient, alcohol 'patient' analogy.
Thank you everyone for responding, including Lou, because it helps me get a different perspective.
Ah, but one of the symptoms of the disease is denying that there is a problem.
It all comes down to what YOU can accept. If him being an A, and doing what an A does (drink, lie, blame) is unacceptable to you, then it might be best that you leave. If who he IS is ok with you, and it is merely some of the behaviours, then it may be possible, with a change in attitude, and some strong boundaries, to be happy while staying. No one knows this but you. What does not work, is hitting your head against a brick wall - living with an A, hating the fact that he is an A, and trying to change something that is not in your power. You cannot change him, you can only change you - your attitude, or your address.
I have an attitude about A's. What do children learn from them ? Well, are you an ACOA? If you visit the ACOA right next door and see what they have to do to undo the effects of growing up with it is one way to see some live action. There are probably many on this board although I see alot of spouse issues. The experience I've had is INSANITY CONTAGIOUS TO ALL WHO ARE INVOLVED WITH A'S . I'm sorry I don't have anything pleasant to report about the after effects of life involving A's. I grew up in a dysfuntional family and after the oldest boy died with lukemia (at 12) none of the adults ever came back spiritually. That was 38 yrs ago. If they couldn't get a pill to deaden with then do it with A. And I mean legal script.Or it was religious addiction.There was no such thing as balance of anything. The 2nd boy was being brought home passed out drunk at 13 . I buried him the month after he turned 40. All the friends were A's cause they seem to attract each other with radar. Same with adults that were in the family. A-mom's 2nd A-hubby put a gun in his mouth in a running car in front his kids house and...........end. I tried to get them help by putting them in a hospital once after they were in blackouts that you can't tell they are in and when they came out, OMG, REVENGE. My A-bro was so staved for attention he'd do anything for my A-mom and she wanted payback. For 10 yrs till he died I was scared for my life, litterally. They got my teenager and partied behind my back when she was 14-15. Now she is 32 with 2 kids that have A-dads too and don't pay and cause every bit of chaois they can imagine to her and the kids. I can't stomach knowing what they are going to have to go thru as I see the effects every time I see them and they are only 6 and 1.5. I could tell HORROR STORIES but this is alot already and just SOME of my experience.
I don't understand why anyone would want to live with them. I did when I couldn't figure a way out and didn't know how big a price it was going to be. I'm 52. There is no doing it over, as its too late in my life. I can only try to make a better future. HAHAHAHAHAHA Whats better when all has been destroyed. I had plenty hope and faith they would see the lite and prayed , prayed , prayed. It's A's choice to make, up to them and their HP. My A-mom's favorite saying was 'GOD protects drunks and children'. She sits here on a visit after not seeing her the last 12 yrs with her wine and she wants forgiveness for not being a good mom b4 she dies. Should I ????? She told my child and my brothers I stole her husband cause she couldn't accept the incest. And still bames me. What child is responsible for that.
On a different note, imagine what love does and how it permeates thru everything , healing, all that love does and they say it does. Alcohol permeates everything with......as noted and some. The intangibles we need in relationships are NOT there when A is involved. To live with them and think children aren't affected , ................???????????? Its a tough one and only the person taking the risk with their life and whoever else involved has to make that choice. Playing with an A is like playing Russian Roulette in my opinion. They are choosing the drink and sacrificing everyone with that choice. No one makes them do it but theirself.
Take what you want and leave the rest. If I'd a had insight upfront, I'd a and never looked back. LOVE HURTS
Be wise and look for strength,courage, and wisdom of HP Take Care BLESSINGS
-- Edited by d53sjurne at 17:41, 2006-03-23
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I tell myself when times are rough, "this to shall pass!!!" Ask HP for guidance, if the door is open, and I know how to look, I will become aware! I also visit http://www.inspiringthots.net/ . Blessings , Your sister in Recovery
You are a success story lko , don't be afraid to ask your questions at meetings we all started out exactly where your at right now and sometimes we forget that and need to be reminded that we too were once newcommers. Have u found a sponsor yet ? someone u feel u can trust and share your life with , sponsors are perfect for the job of answering all those questions.
unexceptable behavior , hmm well we are all diff what is acceptable to me may not be to you a boundary has a clear concequence when crossed the boudary is our and our responsibility to keep it not the alcoholic or other people. My first boundary was not to allow my husb to holler at me anymore , lower your voice i told him and tak to me like u do everyone else or I am leaving the room. the concequnce was I left the room . it didnt take h im long u can't have a discussion of any kind with only one person in the room. This was easy for me to do because I never had to worry about physical abuse. walking away worked for me.
I let him holler at me for yrs he was only doing what had worked in the past. I taught him how to treat me. and then had to teach him what was now unexceptable to me. and stick to it.
no point in discussing a boundary with an A , it's like waving a red flag in front of a bull. Boudaries are for us period . when one is crossed its 'up to us to say so if the behaivor dosent stop . stay consitant.
When my AW is sober, I do not demand much of anything except that she cannot drive and drink. I do make a lot of requests and suggestions, some of which she responds to and some she doesn't. For instance, I have asked her to please not try to have a conversation with me when she is drinking as it will make no sense and she will not remember it the next day anyway. I have also asked her not to cook when drinking for fear of burning the house down. So far she has been pretty good about not trying to have discussions with me when drinking, but she almost did cause a fire when cooking the other night. I guess it is just whatever you can get to work for you. As far as lying goes, I just expect it and live with it because I have caught her doing it so many times when she drinks. It is just so much fun, isn't it?
and never looked back. LOVE HURTS