Thanks Betty but I can't really answer the questions for him. I guess I just wanted someone else's perspective but I know it's difficult to form a conclusion. He says 'maybe he is an alcoholic' because he binge drinks. From what I've read he seems to have many of the symptoms of alcoholism.
Thanks again.

 

 

(((((Geraldine)))))  welcome to the board and you are so right that you cannot answer the questions for him.  What is most important is that if he is truly concerned for his physical, mental, emotional and spiritual health and does not want to succumb to a fatal disease he ought go to a clinic or hospital and get an assessment.  Let the ones that know have the information.  I can tell you from being in that profession just by listening to your share here that the chances are real that he is under the influence of alcoholism.  You have cited evidence here that points toward it and also the physical symptoms he is suffering right now may very well be from the consumption of alcohol.  You cannot imagine how powerful and destructive the chemical is to the human systems.

Suggest that he find an assessment location and then go right away.  This disease is thousands of years old and has killed zillions both drinkers and not.  I was 9 years alcohol free before I took my own assessment and after I turned in the anonymous assessment was told by the head nurse at the rehab I worked for that "whoever the assessment belonged to needed to be in inpatient recovery or the next time they drank they died."  There are so many dangerous levels of alcoholism.  Had him the phone books yellow pages or get on the computer (which I am on now and while an ad for the "Addiction Network" is running on the TV.  He can look that up and call the toll free number.

Today could be the best day for you and for him to start to understand.   Keep coming back (((((hugs)))))

Thank you so much. You are all so kind. I know that none of the things that he's doing are normal and it's causing him problems and I do wonder why I would want to continue to see him. I suppose I want him to change for me but that's never going to happen. I wanted to believe him.

I hardly ever drink - I've never liked it and i guess I don't understand the reasoning behind his drinking. I don't mind normal drinking at all but I know there's a problem when someone's swigging vodka from his bag and he seems to have no embarrassment about being caught out, which I don't understand. He just says that he doesn't need to drink.

Apparently the doctor told him there was a blockage in his intestine and when I asked what the follow up treatment would be he said that there would be none! The next time I asked he told me there was nothing wrong with his intestine???!!

I think there's only so much vomiting and diarrhoea I can take :)

This is all so helpful. Talking to people who know about this makes so much difference to just reading about it.

So, we broke up.

He's writing abusive text messages.

One minute he says he has an alcohol problem. The next he tells me that I'm the problem because I nag him about alcohol ( I thought that i was being very careful about how I approached the problem)

He's still in love with me (he says) and I can still put this right despite the fact that I have behaved so badly - brilliant!! He says he has some minor issues about me that he would like me to address. I say I have one massive issue that I would like him to deal with.

I tell him that the problem starts with a bottle of vodka and that I'm not introducing any of the various problems into the relationship.

He says that he will do the research on the help he needs and will decide on a course of action however, he also says that he only drinks between 4pm and 11pm and not during the week. He works from Monday morning to Thursday afternoon and so his weekends are quite long. He says he doesn't really understand why I think he needs help but then acknowledges that he does.

He acknowledges that when we went on holiday some of his illness could have been self inflicted (I assume he means by alcohol but I insisted he didn't drink during that week away).

My question is, is this me? Am I going completely mad. i don't create problems where there isn't one.

I don't feel in any way guilty. I do feel a loss about what could have been and the future we could have had. Have I got this wrong?

The thinking of an alcoholic is completely addled.  That's why they're full of contradictions, so many contradictions that it can be crazy-making.  Promises and denials at the same time.  Resentment and enticements.  It's the disease talking.  What they most want is for the alcoholism not to interfere with any of the other things they want - I mean, while keeping the alcoholism.  Keeping the alcoholism is priority number 1.  To do this they have to be in full denial of its bad effects, such a complete denial that it almost qualifies them for clinical insanity.  It's the kind of thinking that, like an insane person, no one can talk them out of.  But they also want the ease and fun of having a relationship, so they go through all kinds of maneuvers to convince us that nothing is wrong or if it is wrong they will change it or if it is wrong, it's a delusion on our parts and we need to fix our crazy thinking.  Typically when we try to break up, there are all kind of pleas about how devoted they are and how desolate they will be without us and so on.  If that's true, the doors of AA are always open and they can start without all the promises to us.  But I have seen this pattern over and over and over again: they lure us back with promises of going into recovery, and maybe they even start AA for a while - but as soon as they feel they have us securely back, the AA goes out the window and the whole roller coaster starts up again.

Whenever my alcoholic started AA - and he started many times - I thought, "This is just what I've been wishing for, should I leave now?  Just when what I wanted is happening?"  I didn't realize that recovery is a long hard road and things will not be calm or secure for 1-2 years - if indeed he sticks with it.  My A never stuck with it.  It is two decades along from the first time and he is still drinking.  I finally realized that it was not going to happen, after many more years of pain and false hope than I would wish on anybody, and we separated.

The thing about us Al-Anoners is that we often have our own troublesome thinking - alcoholism drags everyone around it into the insanity, even when we think we still have perspective.  And our own faulty thinking often leads to a syndrome where we decide to leave but then we go back and forth and we return to him, then there's chaos, we break up, we miss him or feel lonely or afraid or sad, we go back, there's chaos, we break up...  And so on.  It doesn't happen to everyone, but to enough of us that it's really helpful to work the Al-Anon program and get all the tools we can to handle the situation, make good decisions (whether to leave or stay), and follow through on them as appropriate.

I hope you'll find a good meeting and take good care of yourself.

Welcome to alcoholism my friend. I wish no one ever had to face this monster again. Abusive texting? Where is the loving, wonderful, kind man who was ther before? He's finding the "soft, accepting, amazing lady" is opening her eyes. We can only hide for so long and finally someone sees. For an alcoholic, this is a major turning point because it is when the "gloves come off". I do not necessarily mean physical. What I am referring to is that loosing that perfect, understanding, accepting "soft landing spot" makes most of them come "unglued" IMHO. When we resist the BS they are feeding us, they can quickly change directions until they find one that works. Most alcoholics have an almost limitless number of "tricks" in their bag to manipulate others, especially those they find most likely to accept their BS excuses or explanations.

You sound by your post to be quite reasonable and quite intelligent and to know the answers to your questions already. AlAnon face to face meetings, even if you only visit for a while, will help clarify what is really going I in your thoughts. It is really quite amazing how quickly we get "sucked in" to the love and support we have always wanted and then don't want to give that up, despite the real things changing everyday. You are certainly not alone with this type of situation and the physical symptoms and the denials and manipulation so you describe seem to me to be clear indicators of alcoholism that has been "left unchecked" for a long, long time. Physical symptoms like ED, diarrhea, inability to stop drinking straight grain alcohol from a bottle and trying to hide it or justify it when caught, and the other behaviors you have described are very serious.

Only he can decided if he wants to stop drinking and he will if he wants to, but never, never for someone else (if he is to become successful). He has to want it more than anything else and he has to be willing to do what is necessary to face the consequences of the years of drinking. "Normal" drinkers simply cannot handle copious amounts of straight grain alcohol. Imagine if you were to drink vodka or gin straigh from the bottle all day and night like that. How would you feel? How would your badly react?

Please consider the meetings. I resisted at first and even took a four year break before going back (after the obligatory six I decided on). I even went back mostly because my now recovering AH kept hinting at it. When I did though, I found a place I belonged and have even sought out a sponsor...for ME!

Alcoholism is progressive and will always get worse...for the alcoholic and for the people they "touch" with their disease. Please consider AlAnon before you make hard and fast decisions, but please remember that abuse of any kind is never acceptable and always gets worse. If we give a child what they want when they scream, they learn to scream louder and longer to get what they want. Alcoholism is very like this only we are generally adults and alcohol and other "rewards" are the point for the manipulative action.

Peace to you and please keep coming back.

The thing is that by all these accusations, arguments, helping, etc., he's keeping you engaged.  And that's his ultimate goal.  He almost had someone who will put up with his drinking (with a little complaining - but they can handle that - it's the staying that counts, and he almost had someone who stayed for all the insanity!  That is having his cake and eating it too for an alcoholic - someone who will put up with the chaos and maltreatment!  They feel so satisfied when they can snag someone like that and have their own personal emotional punching bag).  So he will pull out all the stops to manipulate you to stay engaged with him.

And the craziness is such that it messes with our minds.  I always just found it hard to believe.  It wasn't like breaking up with a normal guy - "Oh well, it didn't work, that's sad, he behaved badly, that was awful, now I'm sad but I'm moving on."  It's more the feeling of having been scammed by a confidence trick.  You just feel blindsided.  "I trusted him but he was really WHAT?"  And there's a sort of craving to undo it and believe it wasn't as bad as it was.

I've observed that many cases are like my case, where I had so much trouble letting go that I thought, "Something extra must be going on here.  Why would I have trouble letting go of someone who treated me badly and who clearly has massive problems?"  Part of it, I concluded, was that my family of origin was neglectful and off-and-on like he was.  They wanted to love me, they were actually good people, but they just didn't have the emotional wherewithal to do it.  So I grew up with that craving for love and that feeling that the best I could get was a kind of half attention.  And the craving to make it different this one time.  So my attachment to him triggered all of that.  Like "At last I will make sure I get the love I want!  From this person whose neglect feels so familiar!"

In my case, I found the saying "Recovery isn't winning, it's not playing."  I had to say it to myself over and over and OVER and over.  Some hours I probably said it to myself 60 times an hour. Because the intrusive thoughts kept coming back.  Not forever, but for a while.  Gradually I got perspective and I saw how sick our relationship had been and I began to thank my lucky stars that I got out when I did.  (Which was, however, not nearly soon enough.)  I only found peace through not engaging with him.  Because all he had to do to keep me engaged was to refuse to see my point of view - and that came naturally to him!  So he had me permanently enmeshed - until I shut the door and refused to play any longer.

Take good care of yourself.  And get lots of support!  It's all so much easier with lots of support.  Hugs.

Hi Geraldine,

IN Al Anon, we have a couple of sayings that I think apply here,. One is that you don't have to JADE - Justify, Argue, Defend, or Engage. Just say your truth and be done. As noted above, the alcoholic will try to keep you engaged, and may think with that he still has you committed to him/her. The hard part for me is the "be done" part. I will go on and on myself hoping that my A gets the point. Then I realize that I can't beat the point into her, either she gets it or she doesn't, but I have said my peace.

We also say that you don't have to attend every fight you're invited to. It's kinda related to JADE.

You're doing well, keep coming back and sharing!

Kenny