The material presented
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AH and I had a couples counseling session last night with our Pastor. It was right after a verbal exchange in which it appears that he may have been untruthful regarding a large purchase and trying to recoup some of that. The exchange came when I asked him about it and he became very defensive, especially when I checked into things just a little further. During our session he said he bought it because he never asks for anything. My response was that he may not ask for a lot of tangible things, clothes or shoes, but bailing him out of jail twice, the lying, the denial, inadvertently making me feel guilty for his drinking, involvement with other women was a lot to ask of me. He just stared at me when I said it, and then looked hurt, then angry. Later in the conversation the subject of my codependence was brought up and that I am in fact dealing with two issues in my head at all times, fixing my codependence and recovering from his alcoholism which for the most part the two are contradictory. There is always a battle in my head as to which way to go, which one to heal first and he was told that is something he needs to understand. His look was of pure resentment and questioned if that is why I am crazy, but anyway today he is different, almost indifferent and a little cold. He said I insulted him with that remark and that those are things he doesn't ask for and if I am co dependent then why do I always want to catch him in a lie I would want to believe him. What?????????
Suzann The entire interaction sounds confusing at best. His observation about you wanting to catch him in a lie is interesting. I would examine my motives to investigate if this is true and if so uncover the truth and move forward.
Alanon suggests that we are each responsible for our own thoughts, actions and attitudes. That by keeping the focus on ourselves, using alanon tools such as living one day at a time, neither judging nor blaming others, we can recover out true selves and assume responsibility for our lives while learning to act and not react to life. Acceptance of life on life's terms is the key. Keep coming back-- it is a process.
Its not that I want to catch him in a lie its that I cant believe a thing he says. I know this about him. When he tells me something ,anything, its not raining today, or the sky is blue, I have to look and see for myself. If I find the sun out when he said it was raining, or vice versa I don't challenge him on that, but when there is a huge part of our savings gone and he promises he will have it back within 5 days, I will challenge him on that. Not in an aggressive way but in a way that is matter of fact. He did not consult me on the purchase, I do not agree with it or why he did it. So I guess, when it comes to keeping my side of the street clean, when faced with a potential dishonest statement that could potentially harm me, I cant say I am looking for a lie, I guess I am just so used to what he lies about. Perhaps I shouldn't say anything at all when I pretty much already expecting it to be untrue. I also think he is upset that for once the focus was taken off of him and he was told he had to understand something about me for a change.
Suzann - all I know is each time we left family counseling, we were angry with each other...it took a few days for things to cool down. There is something raw about being with an outsider and speaking from the heart.
My AH goes out and spends $$ on unnecessary/selfish things. A couple years ago, he came home with a new car during Christmas - a gift to himself. He did it while my parents were here - they come each year for 2 weeks. I believe he thought I would not say anything since we had guests. I did ask what were you thinking, and he said similar to yours - I never ask for anything, etc. I literally just shook my head.
Nothing I was going to say was going to change what he'd already done. I did set a boundary based on that and shared it - when he goes out and spends $$ on himself without a discussion, I would take equal and put it into my retirement account. He hasn't purchased any cars, but he's still spent significant $$ on silly things, and I do what I said - I pull out equal and put it into my account.
So - I found a way to protect me/my future for now. Of course, if it continues, I'll have to re-evaluate but it's workable for me for now. Al-Anon helped me take my power back and be able to find solutions that will work for me for today. I fully understand where you are at - and agree that the counseling session sounds kind of confusing.
Prayers for continued healing for you both...(((Hugs)))
__________________
Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
I do plan on buying myself an reasonably priced but quality pocketbook in the next few days, just because I never ask for anything. lol Im just thinking he got his feelings hurt because his selfishness was put out there and for a brief moment was ashamed. I just decided that it really doesn't matter his motivation for the statements, maybe if he is embarrassed by it he will be willing to change it.
Hi thanks for sharing. I think its good that you are both willing in terms of seeking couples counselling although with alcoholism Im not sure where this would impact. My understanding of alcoholism is its an inner disease, belonging to each person within the relationship and that recovery is a very personal inner thing that isnt dependent on anyone else but the individual so couples counselling doesnt seem to fit into my own understanding. Thats not to say there are no other ways to recover. My own journey with alanon and what Ive learned over the last four years about both feelowhships has led me to see its a very personal spiritual process and its all about the inner self.
The idea of being a 'couple' and trying to recover and gain spirituality seems impossible because recovery can be about gaining a new sense of self and within the ideal of the couple this just doesnt seem possible. Do you know what I mean?
When I was with my ex I had distorted and disturbed ideas and thought processes that ran deep through all my relationships especially my marriage. I was codependant and when I began recovering and looking deep into me and who I was as a person not a wife or mother but just me then the awareness came and then I began recovering. Recovery is not a seperate thing where you recover from one thing and then move onto another. Self awareness begins the process for it all. So your codependancy will go as you become honest about yourself and take the focus completely away from him and what he is doing. Try to remember he is a grown man and can drink if he so chooses. Simple really. He has choices as do you as to what you will accept and what you cant.
It seems to me that you are both focusing in on the little things, understandably so, but often this keeps you both from dealing with the real issues that you both have most likely in equal measures. When I began looking at myself I found that for every single thing I could list about my alcoholic husband I also could say the same for me. Its a hard realisation but well worth it. It freed me from seeing him as bad, stupid, evil, irresponsible etc. This fed my anger and self rightousness and these fed my misery. Alanon meetings, the steps, the reading, the sponsor. Nothing else for it. Anything else is a delay to change.
I don't really know what is the difference between "fixing my codependence and recovering from his alcoholism".
My codependence is part of what made me accept unacceptable behavior and constantly do things for my wife that, if she couldn't/wouldn't do them, should have been left undone so she would feel the consequences of the actions.
My codependence is what makes me want to obsess about her condition, and can keep me from pondering/working on my own condition.
My codependence is what would fill me with rage when my wife did something that wasn't perfect, and consequently she would take a long, hard fall off the pedestal I had made for her. This includes being incredibly angry about all the rehab, legal bills, and lost jobs incurred through our journey.
So for me, those two actions (fixing my codependence and recovering from her alcoholism) are one in the same. And as I recover from my codependence, I was leaving her more and more to herself to recover from her alcoholism, pressuring her less and less about it. For awhile, we grew apart, until we realized just how much we had booth done for each other over the years and finally appreciated each other for who we are, not who we thought the other should be.
My definition of love (this isn't original, it came from JerryF, who got it from his sponsor, who ) is that, if I say I love my wife, I totally accept her in this moment. I may not like the way she is, I may think I don't want to be around certain parts of her, but I accept her, don't put her on a pedestal, neither to do I think she is beneath me because she can't control herself sometimes.
I still struggle with forgiveness of all the money we have spent, we are not desperate but not in the place in our lives I would have hoped financially. So I continue to work on myself, getting the poison of anger out, because the poison of anger kills me, and does nothing to reek revenge on her.
My ex and i did marriage counseling it was a
Waste of time. He did not like being called on
Anything nor would he be honest.
I liked her a lot we had many good sessions
Alone. He met with her alone once.
It takes two mature healthy people to make
A marriage work.
You are better off in therapy for yourself that's
What i did. I had a drug and alcohol therapist
Next. She did not want to see him unless he
Was serious about working on the marriage.
Guess what he did not go. He was attending
AA then too thats all he could handle. I did
Not witness any positive results there either.
Both of my therapists said keep on attending
Alanon. Alanon is all about me and my recovery.
Alanon has saved me on so many levels.
I agree Mirandac I don't think this is the time for us to deal with marriage counseling. I am getting lost in all the different angles. For me Kenny, my co dependence works in that I get my self worth from him achieving his goals. I am a nurse so therefore everybody is my patient, I am in charge of their careplan, it is my responsibility to make sure that I do whatever intervention I have to reach their goal. With my actual patients I am able to detach when they are discharged and if they do not follow their discharge instructions then they will be back, I can accept this. With my husband he is here, his failure is my failure. Thanks el cee Im hoping that comes soon and that did make a lot of sense. I just feel so disconnected from him nothing what I envisioned married life would be, the commercials holding hands in the sunset and Our pastor promoting that we are one.
