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Does anyone here have anything to share about "near-responsible drinking" or anything resembling that after an A has learnt a lesson?
I am totally convinced that its all downhill after the first sip, progressively worsening disease etc. But while I mature applying Al Anon tools, was curious to know if anyone has anything to share on this topic. I was interested only in any experiences in this area.
Manas you have answered your own question. Your understanding and intuition is right on. I am a former therapist and college educated on the disease.
1. Alcohol is a mind and mood altering chemical...it is not a health supporting chemical. It is a solvent that is synergistic (it mixes with other chemicals) it ups the value of other drugs (it only gets worse never better). It doesn't have to go thru the stomach system to do its negative magic...It will pass thru the blood brain barrier from mouth to Central Nervous System (CNS) and cause the first reaction, often relaxation of the nerves and muscles and alter feeling, thinking and perception...it will do more from the first use. Alcohol is in its short form definition a poison like thinner, acetone and others. It alters cell appearance and function...the blood cells of alcoholics are different in shape, size and condition than a non-alcoholic. The cell walls are thinner and more susceptible to further damage. It affects everything it comes into contact with, every organ and condition. There is no protection from it's affects other than not to ingest it.
The side affects from ingesting alcohol are many and this is best to look up within a site which can supply that information. Often times (quite) the affects cannot be reversed and can be opposed by altered behaviors (don't drink).
Alcoholism cannot ever be cured only arrested by total abstinence. Within abstinence if there is no further change in thinking and feeling and behavior the propensity to relapse is often present...the drinker will return to drinking. The cause and effect laws are very noticeable in the disease especially within those who use, abuse and are addicted to the chemical and the rule of cause and effect often is the motivator for the drinker....They drink they experience the effects which they have come to know and understand and think they can control. Alcohol is the great predictor for the alcoholic...The alcoholic can always count on the chemical to change them nothing else or no one else can give the alcoholic the guarantee of the outcomes they have come to count on in drinking. Nothing else and no one else has the influence over the alcoholic as the chemical does (we have tried very often and very often fail).
This is but a snippet of the information I have learned at the knees of those who know and understand so much about this chemical and its power...there is so much more to know and understand considering that this is a 4 level disease of the Mind, Body, Spirit and Emotions.
A wide level of my understanding has come from working with the families (adults and children and relatives) of the addicted and the addicted themselves (including myself). One of Al-Anons greatest tools is in sitting with an open mind and learning before practice, practice, practice.
Keep coming back as this works when you work it. Not all survive. ((((hugs))))
There are some people who can have a bad experience with alcohol, recognize it, and decide to drink less. Those people are called "normal drinkers." The definition of alcoholism is that the person keeps drinking despite it being harmful to his life.
So the real question is: can an alcoholic successfully moderate his drinking? I think if that were true, there'd be no problem with alcohol anywhere in the world.
There is also a model called "harm reduction," which is basically, "Given that a certain number of addicts will not stop using their substance, how can we reduce the harm caused to themselves and others?" That's not a model where the addict is the primary decision-maker, though.
In my experience, probably all addicts have gone through that phase where they say, "I'm able to control it now, I'll just drink/take drugs some and then stop at a certain point." But if they're really, say, out-of-control alcoholics, they shouldn't start drinking, and if they're not, why do they need to? But anyway, trying this out seems to be a phase all of them go through. Many of us codependents do it too - "I'll just get a little bit re-involved with him, because I can control the consequences now." As we all find out, sadly, it's not that simple.
In my personal experience no I have never seen anyone who is truly an alcoholic drink in a controlled fashion. Sure they may pull it off for a short time but then all the problems that were present before show up again usually worse then before. I would have serious concerns about anyone whom was an alcoholic even considering this and question why they would ever consider it given the previous consequences of prior drinking . This demonstrates the never ending pre occupation they have with alcohol when they are not working a program and the preoccupation we have with them . They think they can have power over it this time. We think we can have power over stopping it . And the merry go round continues until someone gets off it. Just my two cents.
I have seen people who came into AA and spent time in recovery. They came to meetings, refrained from drinking (for years, at times) and seemed to be working the program. I have seen some leave and immediately back-slide into a rapid decline - a second or worse bottom. I have also seem some depart from the program and explore 'controlled drinking' for a period of time - 10 years for some....
I've also seen some who leave and end up dead in no time. So, it's a personal path we each embark upon. I've never had the need to go up and ask those who did controlled drinking, "How was it?" I am on a different path and that thinking/action doesn't align with my program.
What I've heard said is that some are able to do it for a while but it will catch up to them and if they are alcoholic, they will be back. I've seen people who change substances too. The only person who can decide if they are alcoholic and need to recover/stop drinking is them. If there is still doubt, they will drink. For how long is an unknown...
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
I had discussed with his doctor and a person who works at the center. Because this is my first time dealing with an alcoholic and I didnt know what to expect, I asked them and they said that he will have to be admitted to the center forcefully again (likely to slip, when he slips). He was nowhere near his bottom and does not listen to himself or anyone. He was acting like a troubling alcoholic from around 6-8 months when I put him in rehab. Probably earlier than most others, but I guess there is nothing like early or late.
My worst fear is that he will harm himself (to the worst extent even). So far, I am dealing with him and with myself pretty well thanks to Al Anon. But if he does anything deadly, here in my country, authorities are terribly corrupt and they will try to extract money, even harm ..
I'm pretty much already done with him, but I don't know how to get rid of him. I do love him and want him to have a life of/on his own. I feel very sorry that he is suffering from this deadly disease.
-- Edited by manas on Monday 14th of March 2016 11:45:58 AM
Prayers and positive thoughts on the way. This is indeed a poewerfully, dreadful disease over which we are powerless. Please continue to take care of yourself
I understand your concern. Is being forced into the institution the only option for a drinker? I'm curious if there aren't people in your country who are alcoholics but who are not in institutions. Because that would also seem like an option to me. I understand that you are afraid that he might harm himself. But what does he want to happen? It is arguable that even alcoholics are entitled to decide their own choices. You have offered everything you can to help him if he wants to stop drinking, but it is clear that at this point he does not want to stop drinking. Would it be possible just to "let go and let God"?
Iamhere, this one is almost surely a rapid decline case.
Mattie, I agree. I desperately want to let go. I think I will get a chance soon. At the moment, it does not seem to be my decision alone. I'm dying to let go and let God.
My ex-AF has flip flopped back and forth between "I know I need help" and "I can control this, now - for sure"... Since Feb 2012, when he first admitted he had a problem and checked himself into 28 day rehab. He stayed sober for 7-8 months, and that has been his longest stretch of sobriety in the passed four years. Anyways - from all I've read, learned, and experienced - controlled drinking is not a long term possibility for As.
