The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
hi, first time I've ever posted on any forum but I suppose that's what desperation does to you?!
i have 2 young children and my husband has been drinking out of control for the last 4 years. It started off as just annoying excessive drinking but gradually developed into more. He 'secretly' drinks vodka before he comes home from work or while we are going about evening tasks so that he ends up uncommunicative or nodding off or no help. He holds down a full time job and a social life. He can be a great dad and is usually a loving person. He doesn't know why he drinks, and always promises to try and keep it under control, which he can do for weeks or months at a time. He is never abusive or violent and hates himself for being unable to control it. He has sought help from an alcohol advisory service, been to counselling and even taken antibuse for months to break the cycle. But at the end of the day we always end up at square 1. The recent downward spiral is pretty bad, we have backed out on a house purchase as I can't risk been financially dependent And I asked him to leave. He refused, but still was drunk so I left with the kids. He has now gone and I'm back in the house. after all this, he can't see a future without alcohol and has chosen that over a family life. Where do I go from here? Stick to my guns and refuse to live with him, or let him back into the family home with his promises of trying to control it But knowing full well that it will end up in a slump again in a few weeks or months? Am I being too harsh on him, given that when its under control we have a great family life, and even when drunk he's not abusive or violent?
Welcome to the board. Sounds like a difficult situation. As you know we don't give advice only share our experience strength and hope. Only you know what works best for you in your life. There are no magic solutions to get the drinker to stop drinking they will stop when they reach bottom and decide to stop. They can't do it for anyone else but themselves as much as they may want to. But you can make choices for what is best for you and your children. A face to face Alanon meeting might be helpful to support you. All the best.
Thank you.
Jaclyn, you say ex, what made you finally realise 'that was it'? His promises are v sincere, he's a nice guy. But he has a 'lads' brain and can't see a way forward without drinking, even though he's losing his children, if I ever doubted that it was a disease, that decision has brought it home. He adores his kids and I can't believe he is even contemplating not seeing them . I can't believe he's not begging after 3 days of not seeing them.
Why do so many people still live with their alcoholic partners? Why do we have to cope and learn tools for ourselves when I don't even want him in the home anymore! is putting up with it the best solution for them as well as for the family? I know people can't give direct advice, just pondering so many questions. I do plan on going to my nearest alanon meeting next week. X
I'm going to suggest what I suggested in another post and maybe it will help get you through to the next week. Google Alanon Speakers and listen to a few of them. You are not alone. While the situations may be different the core feelings are very similar.
All of these questions you have do not have to be answered today. Honestly, some of the questions the answers will always be different, because there is not one of us who is the same we are all unique people with individual personalities that are very different. The steps/traditions in Alanon have taught me a great deal about myself and even about other people.
My XAH is possibly not drinking and found God .. I will let you know he has not spoken to his children since December 2015 and not even a text since January 2016. He's been aware of our daughter being sick and different life event things .. he has moved on to another family to leave them as collateral damage when he's done getting what he needs. When nothing changes .. nothing changes. Dealing with our kids means he would have to accept responsibility and guess what .. he can't/won't .. I don't know and very honestly it's just not my business. Their relationship is between them and granted my kids are older middle school and a high schooler. You wouldn't believe some of the crazy things he has said to our kids. It is actually better even though it's harder with him out of their lives.
Keep coming back and listen to those podcasts, they will give you some perspective that there is life with or without the alcoholic.
Hugs S :)
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Faith minus vulnerability and mystery equals extremism. If you've got all the answers, then don't call what you do "faith". - Brene Brown
"Whatever truth you own doesn't own you" - Gary John Bishop
I understand your question "Why do we have to cope and learn tools for ourselves?" I felt the same way. My story is different from yours, but I eventually realized that I had to learn tools for myself because I deserved it! I deserved to recover, to have sanity and serenity. I deserved to take care of myself because I am worth it. And if I didn't take care of myself, it would be bad for my children.
I often asked myself about the A, "Who behaves this way? This is nuts!" The answer was, someone who is affected by alcoholism. And as to my own thoughts and behavior ... "Who thinks/behaves this way? This is nuts!" The answer was, someone who is affected by someone else's drinking. I was a little bit (OK, a lot) nuts when I got started in Al-Anon.
Learning these tools helped me to not respond to the insanity with more insanity. From listening to others in Al-Anon I learned ways of coping that I had not thought of before.
There were things that were not right
And i let it slide. Then i kept stuffing
My feelings and emotions. I ended Up
very sick and i needed help, i reached
rock bottom, alanon face to face Mtgs
saved me on so many levels. I was in
therapy, both said stay with your alanon
Meetings. I see the wisdom now.
In alanon The recommendation is to not
make any life changing Events for the first
6-12 months unless there is abuse. That is
great wisdom too.
I Was more emotionally and spiritually ready
for the Divorce. Alanon does not promote Divorce
only doing whats best for your own Situation.
We were both in recovery, nothing changes if
Nothing changes. It takes two mature healthy
Adults to have a healthy marriage.
Many can and have lived happy lifes now even
With drinking, some spouses have gotten sober
And now work their own recovery too. There are
No cookie cutter answers. Its a disease and we
Get Highly effected in our own way that is what
Alanon Is all about helping us recover and learn,
listen and Absorb the wisdom from those before
you. It takes Lots of practice and lots of meetings.
Aloha Beanie and welcome to the family. My spirit and heart go out to you and every other victim of this disease either in MIP or not. I have not ever come up against a disease such as this quite often because it is so cunning, powerful and baffling. You get to believe that you have assets and strength and support and unless you have Al-Anon and or MIP or such you are being deluded. Alcoholism cannot be cured; only arrested by total abstinence and that one piece of information put me on notice on a daily basis...we are not cured and they are not.
I was taught the definition of humility when if found the rooms of Al-Anon and then taught how to work it. Humility is being teachable...sit down, listen with an open mind and then practice, practice, practice what you hear and see the fellowship doing.
That is the right thing for me in hind sight...it is what I did after not doing it for soooo long that surrendering to the program completely became the only option I could imagine. Go to meetings, read the literature, memorize the slogans, find a sponsor and WORK IT!! That is the only right thing even now after years of recovery. There are times you will imagine the right thing and then come to realize a mistake...we do the 1 step forward and 2 steps back from time to time until it mostly comes forward. Hanging with the winners here and in the face to face meetings of Al-Anon brings us back to yes that was the right thing for me and for those I'm learning from.
The alcoholic is a very very sick person...just as sick as we become in the process ...that's sad. Keep coming back and join us in recovery. (((((hugs)))))
"Jaclyn, you say ex, what made you finally realise 'that was it'? His promises are v sincere, he's a nice guy. But he has a 'lads' brain and can't see a way forward without drinking, even though he's losing his children, if I ever doubted that it was a disease, that decision has brought it home."
Beanie1 - I wish I had a good answer for you. The trouble is that I am struggling very much each minute/day to stick to my resolve. In my situation, my fiancé left me when I set boundaries and to be completely honest, told him that he "needed" to get well for us to move forward. He jumped through the hoops for a while and then seemingly all of a sudden, just stopped and bailed. He had reasons that blamed me for everything, of course (not to say I had no part), but ultimately it came down to him rejecting the me that called him on his sh*t.
Re having a "lad's brain" - I have learned that many alcoholics do. It is said that addicts are the age at which they began drinking/using. They simply stop maturing at that point in many areas. Wanted to let you know that was a good observation, and you are not alone in that.
Welcome to MIP Beanie! Glad you found us and glad you shared.
Know that you are not alone - keep coming back....(((Hugs)))
__________________
Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Only you know when you have had enough. I found my answers in al-anon meetings and working through the steps my sponsor who I found at those meetings. They have online options for meetings here as well. The book "Getting Them Sober" by Toby Rice Drews helped me a lot.
__________________
Sending you love and support on your journey always! BreakingFree
Al-Anon/Alateen Family Group Headquarters, Inc. 800-344-2666
" Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional."
"Serenity is when your body and mind are in the same place."
Thanks everyone. I'm 3/4 way through the 'getting them sober' book after seeing it recommended on here. To be honest, While parts of it have helped, quite a lot of it is dedicated to the controlling nature of the alcoholic. I don't (or maybe don't want to) relate to that. My husband doesn't put me down, although I can see that he plays mind games with me about the denial, which is still controlling me. I'm financially stable, the house is in my name and I know I can manage without him, but that still doesn't make a decision any easier!! I don't want my kids in a split family, but I know that sounds stupid when the alternative is in an alcoholic one!! I'm the one still in denial! He's visited and made all the right noises about giving up and can he move back in. He's putting all his hopes on taking antibuse but we've been there before. I've told him I'm not ready to have him back but I know my resolve will slip as soon as he's on the tablets and returned to sober husband again. It helps just writing things down, you see the situation in a different light.
Can anyone say whether the actual AA meetings for the alcoholic are based on God (the 12 steps seem to be all about trusting in a higher spirit and God) ? my husband is a complete atheist and wouldn't buy into it.
Alanon Literature does attempt to teach us to focus on ourselves, trust HP and live once day at a time I am sorry that the book that was recommended did not follow these guidelines.
Both AA and Al-Anon's 12 steps urge members to believe in a power greater than themselves. They can define this power as God or a God of their understanding.
There are many atheists in both Al-Anon and AA and they have been able to define a constructive Power Greater than Themselves that works for them. I know that when I first entered the rooms I defined my Higher Power as the philosophy and tools of the recovery program and Al-Anon. That worked perfectly.
Al-Anon meetings helps me to keep the focus on myself and my recovery while allowing my partner the dignity to work out his own recovery. It is apparent that your partner is interested in sobriety, so that hopefully he will find a counselor or group that will assist. An AA sponsor can help to answer any of his quetions and would be a great help Meanwhile, I do hope you keep coming back.
I can only share my experience... also have two young children though they sure have gotten a lot older since this whole ordeal began. I saw my AH's crazy and chaotic behavior way before I ever realized it came from abusing alcohol. In fact, I am still not sure to what extent they are interwoven. He began to be jealous and angry and paranoid... we had many nasty fights late at night in which he accused me of cheating, lying, etc. Only now do I look back and wonder how much that was fueled by alcohol... we were social drinkers who had gotten to a point where we drank every night, though I never saw enough alcohol get drunk to make an association. However, I think it was enough that when he accused me of crazy stuff (often, the same things over and over, although I over and over explained why his fears and accusations were unfounded), I had enough wine in me to fight back and take it personally instead of walk away or make other good choices.
Anyhow, it took awhile, but he was drinking secretly, and suddenly his behavior reached a tipping point, and was going downhill quickly. He put our children's lives in danger by drinking and driving, and I still did not know until several of our children's friends told me what they had seen and smelled. I still cannot believe how blind I was! It was almost 2 years ago that came out into the light, and his recovery has had many fits, starts, and stumbles. Unfortunately, he still lies. And, when he secretly drinks and then lies about it, his misbehavior is all directed toward me, accusing, pointing the finger, trying to take the attention off of his bad choices, etc.
I moved out 8 months ago. And although he said he hit bottom when he saw the empty closet, he is still going through all the same rigamarole. I don't think he drinks very often, but who knows. He says he never drinks and drives the kids, and I have no idea if this is true or not. He finally agreed, in recognition of the broken trust between us, that he would take a breathalyzer test any time I asked. We each have a breathalyzer. The last 2 time I asked, he refused. "I would take it, no problem, but I'm not going to because you don't trust me." (bangs head). Last time, 3:30 pm on a friday, he suggested I might be drunk and should take it. When I said, fine, I don't drink in the afternoon but I am happy to take it" he accused me of having a boyfriend. Anything to get the the attention of of him.
And despite all this, I still am not SURE which is worse for my kids: a broken home or an alcoholic home. Truly. And, we also have good family times when everybody is sober and acting sober (this includes me, not due to alcohol but from all the baggage that comes with all this.) But, I know I cannot survive and thrive in an alcoholic home where the A keeps lying to me, and, accuses me of so much ridiculous stuff. It may be only words, but it is draining, and I believe I deserve more.
I am very glad that your AH's behavior is not abusive in any way. Mine was only verbally/emotionally abusive, but it got scarier and freakier over time. And I was told many times that it would continue to progress if left unchecked... that someday it would likely cross over from verbal/emotion to worse. And, what I saw was that even if it didn't, the craziness was provoking me to the point that who knows what I might do.
I am still in limbo after 8 months, wrestling with that issue. I don't want to let go of the dreams of a happy family life. And an intact home for my children. But, it involves living and surviving with somebody who lies to me - because he lies to himself first. Trust is gone. I second guess everything he says, no matter how benign. And it's a long road to get back to that kind of trust. He has a program, but it's very halfhearted. He doesn't fight for it. (i.e., he will cancel a planned AA meeting for any reason, will never go to one besides his 'routine' one, etc.) I really thought things would be clearer by now - either he wouldn't be 'working it' at all, or he would have embraced it after hitting his bottom. But it's been about the same for a long time now. And it is better than nothing - but... Anyhow, that is all I have to offer, besides the very important fact that Al-Anon has been my life-saver. I would never wish to be in this situation, but I am grateful to be learning the tools and strategies now, before I go any further along in life. I believe they will serve me no matter what situation I find myself in. All the best to you, as you figure this out for yourself. Wish there were more concrete answers.
