Wow pink chip that is so insightful thank u! :) more awareness :) :)

(((Helpangel))) - hugs for you and I can relate! What I have figured out in recovery - while we think nobody knows, typically some do know. What we 'see' inside our homes, they've 'seen' in our yards/driveways/etc. I could give example after example, but that's not what's important. For me, for a long while, I isolated and chose to not go/do. Then, I slowly got more brave and began to attend. I did fib a few times and then my statement/answer was, "this isn't his kind of thing - he didn't want to come."

I spent a long time fibbing to my boys about why their father wasn't 'there' or 'here'. That was one of the first truths I found by truly embracing the three Cs. I don't have to tell my whole story and share his illness, but I can be truthful in stating that he wasn't interested. As I said, in my world, many knew more or had thoughts based on what they had seen/heard. Same with my boys - when the popo are at your house a few times each year, the folks in the hood know there are issues.

It took program work and living one day at a time for me to be able to attend, be proud and not compare my insides to other people's outsides. I've come to learn that every home/family/relationship has dysfunction - some greater than others. It's my job to be me, love me, not concern myself with what other's think and to be happy - with or without my As.

I do understand and I still have those fleeting thoughts of why me, why us, why ...... and then slowly my mind says, why not me? Why not us? And, I find gratitude in knowing that it could be worse.

Be kind to you today and be gentle with you. Work your program and you'll get through it and to the other side - no matter what he's doing or not doing! Keep coming back and great to see you 'feel' your growth!

Have you read the book Getting Them Sober Vol 4? I think the gal's name is Toby Rice Drew, anyway, it's a great book and it's about leaving and the what if's in going back. It's black belt Alanon and should be CAL approved lit as far as I'm concerned.

For me I had to stop focusing on the "why's" of the situation and start focusing on the "what" .. what do I deserve? What do I want? What do I want to change about me? Those 3 questions were a huge start for me finding out that life does go on with or without the A. The only thing I regret if I had to use that word was allowing the yo-yo'ing I did with him. He was insistent I wanted him back .. I didn't want him .. I wanted the dream. I wanted to recreate him into what I thought he should be and honestly it was incredibly selfish of me to do so .. after all he's a whole different person and he was never beholden to be what I thought he should be.

I do get what you mean about feeling like the 3rd wheel in couple situations however you know what I take it as an opportunity to get to get outside my comfort zone and it's good for me in general to be social. After some initial weirdness I'm able to relax and enjoy the time and it's also taught me there are times I'm soooo glad to be single and other times I think what can I learn from this couple as to what I do want. So for me it's about keeping an open mind.

Keep coming back it really does get better!!

Helpangel, I can understand that you still have connections with your husband,
though it sounds like you are separated. And it sounds like you are separated
because of his drinking and the sheer incompatibility of your relationship with
him. He sounds like he creates an awful lot of anxiety and somewhat
depresses you. Why are you even talking with him?

-- Edited by Debb on Monday 17th of August 2015 08:01:22 PM

(((((HUGE SQUISHY HUG HELPANGEL)))))

 

I really relate to you. It must be difficult having so many facets of your life intertwined with this fellow. I know it doesn't feel like it now, but the great thing about life is that it's so varied. There are countless options and opportunities. There are other jobs. No such thing as a helpless situation. I'm not trying to tell you what to do, I could never do that, but I'm letting you know that I've been very pleasantly surprised by what life offers and surprises me with when I make steps towards your own salvation, like you're doing. Sometimes it has been despite me, not because of me, that new opportunities have arrived. It certainly doesn't happen because I do life perfectly, but it happens because despite appearances, this can be a very kind place to live. There's no reason it would be different for you, than it has been for me. Circumstances may have given you the impression that you yourself aren't worthwhile and that help, blessings, boons and wonderful solutions don't exist, but maybe that's not the ultimate truth. I'm sure you're talented and skilled, and I see no reason to doubt that there is a fruitful path ahead of you. You don't have to be punished forever.

 

Helpangel, when you said:

"He called me this morning (work question) and to say again he missed me and that he knows we can make it- he watch a show and now is convinced that we will get back together sometimes. I have anxiety even thinking about it so I just say well if u can stay sober and work your program for a year."

it really reminded me of a conversation I had with my mother the other day. She had been sober for a while so I re-introduced her to mine and my childrens' lives, and then she recently fell off the wagon again.

She had called to ask me if I intended to cut her out of our lives like I have done in the past. Note: cutting her out, slamming that door shut with anger and hurt in my heart, HURT ME. I notice people talking about 'loving detachment' and I absolutely know there is great wisdom in that. Cutting my alcoholic person out with resentment meant that I held it all inside me so much that I may as well have been physically joined at the hip to her :) It did not set me free. Only I can do that, I realize now, within my own self.

The subtext of what my mother was saying when she was asking if there was hope for a continued relationship was 'please tell me you love me and that everything will be OK otherwise I will continue drinking'. But I know she doesn't mean to manipulate like that. It's all her illness, poor woman. She is just hurting.

In that conversation, for the first time in my life, I didn't have an answer to give her. I could only say, 'I don't know. I have to work on my own recovery, and I'm not sure what that will mean as I grow and change.'

Caught in the tug-of-war of mixed feelings and opposing opinions and anxiety like you described, I have learned from the past not to even try to make a decision. What I feel today is almost guaranteed to change. And circumstances are too unpredictable. I don't know that she will be alive to have a relationship with. I don't know that she won't be imprisoned again. I can't fathom the changes al-anon will bring about in me. The fat lady hasn't sung yet, my friend.

I didn't have it in me to revert to the old pattern of comforting her without any personal honesty or boundaries, just telling her what she wanted to hear. I couldn't get behind the idea of reverting to an alternative old pattern which was angry accusation and slamming the door shut on her, either. Neither were options available to me. Neither felt authentic. All that was true was - I don't know. I love you, and I don't know. I can't take the role of savior or of executioner, because the reality is, I am unwell in all of this. I need to heal myself, that is where my energy must go. I had only just realized this.

It was new for me to 1) be present and aware of what is true for me (I lost the sense of 'self' to even have a personal truth) and 2) to not be responsible for her. This was the first time I gave her an answer that wasn't taking her into account, wasn't censored or carefully scripted or devised to produce an outcome in her. It was new for me to just be honest and let the chips fall where they may, to just let it be as it is and let mum feel whatever she feels about it. Not trying to save her or punish her, not convoluting myself as part of a chess game like you describe.

I'd like to add here that I'm not sharing any of this because I think it's how YOU should think or feel or behave. I'm sharing for my own recovery, and because it was so helfpul to me to read about another person having a conversation similar to the one I had had. I fully trust that you are finding your own way.

This experience helped me realize the wisdom of the slogan 'one day at a time'. How on earth can we project ourselves into the future and speak for that self? How can we possibly make decisions with so little information? Literally all we can reasonably do and respond to is what is in front of us now. I think it's a form of culturally conditioned, left brained insanity that wants everything in definitive boxes, and I think this contributes to our illness as al-anons. All that is reasonable to do is surrender the situation and do my best as it unfolds. I'm changing all the time. As I learn this program I think my wisdom will increase. A hurt person has to work on sanity gently. Splitting myself into an imagined future creates a lot of anxiety because I cannot act in that future. I only have today. And the days ahead will unfold as they do, no matter what I want to happen. And, it doesn't matter if I do the tango, do a backflip, emigrate to Africa, marry a midget - mum will do what mum will do. I have no power there.

Right now for me a day at a time is too long to manage. I am having to bring myself back to one moment at a time. I can only manage that. I notice myself not being present here now because I'm all caught up in pains and fears and thinking. That makes me useless, I can't take basic simple steps on my own behalf or function very well unless I bring myself to NOW. Only now. This pattern of being elsewhere has been very detrimental to my life.

Maybe all that is required for you in the chess game is to continue to read the Al-anon literature, come here, and be very, very kind to yourself. I see you have a lot of self awareness and a real strength and grace is blossoming within you. That's what it looks like from here. I feel like you know what is right for you and are moving at the perfect pace.

 

 

 

 

 

-- Edited by hiraeth on Monday 17th of August 2015 09:45:55 PM

Well I think that if you have to have work contact with him, just keep it at work and
about work. If you have to have contact with him about your children, then just
keep it at that and detach from the rest so that you can have peace and move on.