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I really need some opinions here. I know rehab is not always the answer, and I know a person has to be ready to accept recovery.
While talking to my husband today, as usually he was parroting his Mother, "My Mother doesn't think I have a problem." My Mother says none of this is my fault." My Mother says you think you are Saint Jeannie, and are trying to put all the blame on me." My Mother says you will not let go of the past."
I told him I wasn't a Saint, and that I do not believe that everything is his fault. I said that I have my own issues, but as long as he is drinking, I cannot accept the way life is. I said that I will take responsibilities for my actions but not his, and in a less quiet moment I told him I do not give a sh*t what his psychotic Mother thinks or says and dared him to complete a full sentence without telling me what his Mother said.
Then I told him that I can't let go of the past when the problems of the past keep repeating themselves, mainly his drinking, lying and maybe even most of all his Mother.
He then asked me if I really believed he needed help for his drinking, and I told him yes I believe it, but he is the one who needs to beleive it. He then told me his Mother doesn't think he needs it, and that she thinks I just want him locked up for 30 days away from her, and me, so I can see otehr people. I asked him if that is what he thought, and he sais, he doesn't believe the other people part. He said he doesn't believe I want to cheat on him, and I told him I love him and don't. he said his Mother says I don't want this marriage, and I told him once again she is wrong, that I love him and want him well.
He then asked me if he went into rehab, when he came out, and he said he would be out by December 1st would I go talk to someone about how I feel about his family and to learn how to deal with the past and put it behind me.
I told him that I will do one better, that I would go speak with someone before he got out, that I believed I do hold a lot of feelings about the past and I do (and rightly so) have a lot of negative feelings about his family.
Okay, I know I can't bargain with an A, and I know he thinks he is putting something over on me with this. I don't really care. I am more than willing to talk with a counselor, and it can only help me sort things out.
Is agreeing to this manipulating him, or letting him manipulate me? It still remains to be seen if he follows through and sighns himself in. But if he does, is he doing it for the wrong reason, thinking he has manipulated me into counseling?
My thoughts are that he brought it up, that no matter how he gets tehre, maybe it will sink in. I know you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink, but if you lead him there, isn't the rest up to him?
I know he has to do it for him, but I also know he cannot be with this family while he is drinking. He says he wants us back, and he wants to be alive to see his children grow. He says he will do what he has to.
Am I making a mistake? Am I wrong to say I will go to counseling, I do think it will be good for me. He is saying he will go in defiently, and in order to get me to do something he wants me to do. Or maybe he does want to go in, and is using the counseling as a way to believe that it is not all his fault.
I think no matter what the reason, him being willing to go in is the first step.
i believe counselling could be very beneficial to you. we all have alot of stuff to deal with as well and a relationship is a 50/50 thing. i was told even if an a becomes sober chances of divorce are high if the other spouse dosnt get help for themselves as well. you need to deal with your own stuff. love yourself so you can love others. just something to think about
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stay in the now...dont look forward, dont look back....your life is what you make of it
I think if you want to go to therapy, go. Don't do it for him. Do it for you and your kids. You will have those other people in your life so you might as well figure how to deal with them-- they are you kids relatives anyway. As far as your A--I figure if it gets him into treatment, its a step in the right direction. Don't over analyze who's idea it was (you sound waaaaay too much like me when you do that!) The whole story of him hiding behind Mother's protective accusations is really sad. Don't you just want him to grow up and think for himself (but its hard to when you are using) good luck in your decisionmaking Jeanne
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In the long run the pessimist may be proved right, but the optimist has a better time on the trip.- Daniel L. Reardon
Didn't you and your spouse go to counseling already? Didn't that counselor tell you two that he needs to stop drinking first? And in my experience, if the person goes to treatment for another reason rather than themself then the success rate is not good. One addiction counselor did tell us that sometimes after being in treatment a few days a person may indeed decide to stop drinking for them too. Relapse after a treatment program is pretty common too so if his heart is not in it for HIM to quit drinking then that does not sound like a good sign. My daughter's addiction counselors at her different treatment programs also said that family therapy is not the focus right away. They need to work on them and get better before the family therapy will work. I wonder if he is getting desperate to come back home and is trying to comply to what he thinks will make you take him back and thus all talk and no action. cdb
It seems that when you get involved with your A and his family it starts getting dysfunctional. I follow your posts and your responses (sometimes to me). You seem to make really good decisions on your own that probably benefit your A in the long run.
Yes my husband and I went to counseling together. The counselor told us that my husband was an alcoholic and he should sighn himself into rehab. He also told him he had some huge issues with his parents and should limit contact with them. He also told him that I did not have an anger problem. My husband then got angry with the counselor and refused to go back.
Now he is insisting that if he goes into a treatment program, I should go and talk with a counselor on my own.
One thing that sets him off is when anyone tells him that he is the problem and not me. His Mom is always telling him that his drinking is not a problem I am, and he likes what she has to say. As long as he is still drinking, his Mom will have an open line to him. She does not want him to go into a rehab, and has fought it for years. Even to the point of forbidding it a few years ago.
I think he is getting desperate, I do know he wants to come home, but I can't allow it while he is drinking. He has no job, (he was fored for drinking) He was diagnosed with liver disease and told if he does not stop he will die (Mom says the Dr is exxagerating).
He says he wants to come home and wants to be alive to see teh kids grow up. He is insisting that he will go into treatment, but only if I am willing to go see a counselor when he is done. It seems to me like he cannot do anythng that puts all the blame on him and needs to see some of it go onto me. I am not too concerned about that if in fact he will accept treament.
I think in rehab they do force them to look at themselves, whether he will actually see himself is another thing. If he thinks when you go to counseling it will make you agree with his mother, I'm sure he has another thing coming there too. He may have to admit that his mother isn't the all knowing, all seeing OZ he thinks she is. He may have to accept that a counselor may suggest you detach from his mother.
Christy
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If we think that miracles are normal, we will expect them. And expecting a miracle is the surest way to get one.
Ty for welcoming me back :) I was just visiting my mom/dad again. My mom's alzheimer seems to be progressing :( At least they live close enough now to visit. I guess to me it seems like your A is bargaining with you which makes him still in control in his mind. I haven't seen where you need counseling. You have progressed so well in this program and are such a strong woman and mother. He doesn't seem to have cut the apron strings yet either in my humble opinion. Why bargain with an A? Wait a day and re-read what you typed here and see if you get a different perspective. It sounds like they are trying to get you sucked into the drama again and maybe getting engaged with agreeing to someinthing in the future is his game/manipulation. How about telling him you will attend any family meetings at treatment and then see what they recommend you do when he is done and leave it up to the professionals there to decide and not him or his mom? Just thinking out loud again. cdb :)
"Or maybe he does want to go in, and is using the counseling as a way to believe that it is not all his fault."
When my husband went to rehab, he was insisting the whole way that he had no intention of permanently sobering up. "I'll do it, to keep my job", and "I guess it won't hurt me to dry out for a few days, but don't expect me to join AA or anything". It was all a big front. He was desperate, knew he needed help, but was just too, too, too ALCOHOLIC to admit it. That was 2 1/2 years ago, he has been sober since.
I don't know if you need counselling, probably you don't really know either. My feeling is - it wouldn't hurt. It would be another aspect of the alanon thing - working on yourself.
I'd like to comment on another aspect of this - the whole 'fault' thing. The further I get into this program, the less useful I find it to worry about whose fault anything is. He's an A, his mother seems to have some problems, but, if you are honest, you know that you have a part in these relationships. Someone mentioned, earlier, that you will always have to have a relationship with these people, they are your children's relatives. Therefore, it's in your own best interests to work out a way for you to be able to deal with these realities. Just thinking "Oh, he's a drunk and she's crazy, none of it is my fault" doesn't get you anywhere - it may be true, but it's beside the point. Better to identify ways in which your own behaviour makes things worse, and learn to behave differently. Leave 'fault' and 'blame' to the people who are sick, who need it to justify themselves. You're an alanoner, you can say "Let it begin with me".
I do not know if I need counseling, but I agree it could not hurt. No matter what I do, I do have some anger issues with my husband, (no they have not driven me to anger management). But I think I could use some perspective on how to put some events of the past behind me. I have put up some huge walls between him and I as a way of protecting myself from his abuse and more importantly him allowing his Mother to abuse me. If in fact he does find recovery, the only ope our marriage will have is if I allow the walls to come down.
I do love him, and I do not want to divorce him.
I agree with what some of you have said, these people are my childrens family and if I am honest, I more than dislike them, it borders on hate and disgust. The things they have subjected me to over the years are horrible, as they attempted to justify their sons drinking. In reality they have been much crueler to me than he has, but the truth is they are his parents and rather than protect the wife he supposedly loved, he allowed it. I need to find a way to coexist with them.
I also agree that blame is not important, though I cannot let his family know that. They will use anything as a way of putting the blame for everything on me.
I have my own issues to deal with, so I think I feel good about this. Now I just wait and see if he is just making promises he does not intend to keep. He says he will be out by December 1st, so he would have to go in within the next week or so, I guess I will know soon enough.
If he is seriouse I will wait for as long as he needs me to. I do not want to walk away from my marriage. But if he is playing more games, the time is coming where I will have to make a decision to move on. Something I do not want to do.
Hi Jeannie. Good to "see" you again. I think whatever feels right to you, you must do. You are so very focused. Trust your judgment, but be sure you are doing this for you. The unpleasantness you've been through with him AND his family is a hard rock to get over; if you feel counseling would be of help, by all means go for it.
Best wishes, Diva
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"Speak your truth quietly and clearly..." Desiderata
When I was reading your post I was thinking about my husband and the things he does... My A husband would never bring up treatment unless he was thinking about it himself. He would NEVER say he would do something unless he already knew that he needed it. He would how ever do the same thing yours is make it a barganing chip in his favor or use his going as a barganing chip to ultimately make it something that he had one up one me. This is just the sickness talking... Knowing this I would agree to anything if he would go to treatment but I also know that I need help of my own...
Also when my A used to say that I was the only one that had a problem it was a big fight!!! We would agrue about who's problem it was and he would never admit that he had a problem...it totally blew him away that I finally admitted I did have a problem and I did it was his drinking... this all came from a dear friend who was in the same situation as me with her A husband who at the time did go to AA but never knew about alanon back then. She had great advice back then but I did not see it until much later...
You know in your heart what you need to do for your self and I say follow your instincts they are great... I get alot from your posts!!
Hp at work here. I went to my first counselling session with a D/a counsellor tonight. I made the appointment because I wanted to look after me for a change. Don't go to the counsellor because you are being told to do it. If you want to go let it be on your own terms. I found it really good as there is no al-anon here. The focus of the session was on me and the drinking of my A but not once was I told that I was the problem. The things I was confiding in the counsellor were trust issues, what I am prepared to accept etc. I personally found it good to unload and had a good cry which I don't tend to do very often. She advised that down the track it would probably good for my A and I to go to a marriage counsellor to work through other issues. Hope this post helps in some way. Luv Leoxx
Tell his mother if she doesn't think he has a problem to let him move into her house and mess up her life...my ex parent in laws never really reliazed how bad there son was until he was living with them. Soundenly I wasn;t just the bitter ex wife. Unfortuniatly A's can seem to manipuate the ones closest because they really don't want to see the truth. Stand by your guidelines and boundries regardless. All the best you jorney
He has been living wiht his parents, he wants to come home.
They wait on him hand and foot. They clean his room, do his laundry, bring his food to him in his room and come and take the dishes away when he is done.
They give him money and provide him with beer.
He has no responsibilities what so ever. He has lsot his job and they do not feel he needs to support his children.
He lives like an overaged teenager. In fact I have teenagers and they have a whole lot more responsibilities and are a lot more mature.
