The material presented
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information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
Thank you for all the responses to my boo hoo posted titled, "what have I done?"
Yes, I do take too much on. It frustrates me how talking to him puts me into an entirely different mindframe, and his aism and addiction becomes minimal. I do have a lot of guilt and it drives me crazy that he continues to berate me for it while not taking any responsibility himself. Also, perhaps this is selfish, but I want the opportuntity to change my behavior and make it better.
So, this is a text he sent me yesterday. I am forming a response and I'd love your opinions. Particularly, is it wrong to want to fix our marriage for the kids? Of course, I want it for me too, but this statement spoke volumes in terms of the selfishness I am dealing with. It makes him crazy that I can't accept his justification, rationalization and denial.
I may not give it to him today because we have a marriage class tomorrow and I don't want to jeopardize going. I know you all may think I am nuts, but it is a wonderful introspective program and can only help, together or apart. The classs tomorrow is on conflict management.
The text read, "I don't mean or want to be hurtful or rough to you. I know you are doing the best you can. I think you may be wanting to fix our relationship for the kids! And perhaps may be confusing this with wanting to do it for you? I find myself getting angry and being hurtful to you becasue making my feelings and opinions heard by you doesn't seem to get to you in other ways. Doesn't seem to get to you in that way either?
So, what do you think? Any witty responses out there?
Blessings, Lou
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Every new day begins with new possibilities. It's up to us to fill it with the things that move us toward progress and peace. ~ Ronald Reagan~
Sometimes what you want to do has to fail, so you won't ~Marguerite Bro~
It occurs to me that perhaps you ARE being more detached from him than you have in the past - even if it's not as much as you'd like to be - that he's noticing this, and that he wants you back in your familiar to him, & therefore reassuring, totally enmeshed mode.
It also took me a couple of tries to even understand what he was saying.
That makes me think that "don't even try to be reasonable with an active alcoholic" applies. I'm not sure I would answer at all - one way of interpreting this is "I'm having a way harder time getting a rise out of you", and the answer to this is yes! this is GOOD! - but there's no sense in saying it to HIM.
My take on the marriage/kids business is this: saving a marriage for the children is not ENOUGH. Eventually the kids will grow up & move out, & at that point you don't want to have a marriage that exists solely for the children. You want to save the marriage because it's worth saving, because you believe that the two of you can reconstruct a joyful and mutually responsible & respectful relationship. And if you DON'T believe it - maybe that's something to think about.
I guess I am a little confused. You did ask if it was wrong to want to salvage the marriage for the kids.
It seems to me in his text to you, he's feeling that is the main reason you are wanting to salvage the marriage.
I'm not seeing the selfishness in his response in regards to that area, only calling it as he sees it.
I don't know a lot of the stories here, but is your A still drinking and/or using?
I'm always somewhat amazed, though I do understand it, why folks try to 'fix' a marriage/relationship while there is still active alcoholism. I rather liken it to trying to stomp out a forest fire with your shoes.
I hope I didn't offend you. I'm just trying to understand your post!
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"If a dog will not come to you after having looked you in the face, you should go home and examine your conscience." - Woodrow Wilson
I would agree that kids from divorced families are way better of than kids currently living in alcoholic/addict parents don't love eachother anymore or fight all the time families! That's what I have heard anyway. The only person you aren't considering in this equation is you and your wants and needs. Set aside the kids and him for a minute and ask yourself is this what I want? Am I happy living this way? Do I want to continue with more of the same? Imagine for a moment you didn't have kids and it was just you and him, would you stay then? I think if you do the right thing for you in the end it will work out to be right for the kids too because an unfulfiled unhappy mom doesn't make for happy well adjusted kids.
Yeah, I'm not toatally sure what he was saying either. I know he doubts I ever loved him since it wasn't in the way that mattered to him. Also, I've referred to hanging in there for the kids. But, that is not exclusive; it is for me to. I want to create the marriage we never had. As for if I would still be here if it wasn't for the kids.... I could support the aism and addiction, I think, but it is the infidelity that gets me. Even though I know they are related, that alone makes me crazy.
He says things to justify and rationalize his actions like, kids just "want their parents to be happy". I see this as only partially true in that I know our kids "want parents who are happy and have committed to eachother and are living in the same household". They will not be happy to know their dad chose to leave thier mom to love another woman (whom they know), no matter how joyous it makes him.
Is he an active alcoholic right now? I don't think so. Is he using some? I would say yes, but hard to know. His drug use is always so subtle, and since it went on for years I really don't have any idea who he is anymore, other than knowing the grumpy guy who presents himself isn't who I married. I think his drug use is mild but consistent, always just enough to numb the pain but still function.
He is being inducted into the Diversion Program next week. Since his main employee quit, he has no one there to keep him accountable. I hope he doesn't quit when the demands get too high. Hopefullyhe'll use this privledge and precious opportunity to get well.
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Every new day begins with new possibilities. It's up to us to fill it with the things that move us toward progress and peace. ~ Ronald Reagan~
Sometimes what you want to do has to fail, so you won't ~Marguerite Bro~
You know, it might be time to ask yourself exactly the question he seems to be asking - do you really want to be married to him? and why?
"But I love him " is not an answer-personally I don't really believe it's an answer to this question even with 'normal' people, and certainly not with alcoholics and co-dependents. The questions are "what am I getting out of this marriage?" "is it worth the price I am paying for it?" "could I get it in another way, without the marriage?" "what damage is the marriage doing to me?" "am I looking at the reality of my marriage, or at my life as I wish it could be?"
If you find that your main reasons for wanting him have to do with unwillingness to let go of the past, and fear of the future, then maybe he is right. Maybe you both would be better off apart. If you have other reasons, then it's time to let him know. From what we saw of his note, he doesn't really believe that you love him. I know that there were long stretches of my marriage when I loved "my husband" - the idea of him. The actual physical man, i wasn't too crazy about. He sensed this, but when he accused me of not loving him, I took that as a challenge, and tried to show just how much I would do for him. Reality - he was right. At that point, I didn't love him, I was just determeined to make the marriage work, in spite of him. Sadly, marriage doesn't work that way. You can't be married all by yourself.
You can't do it by yourself. You can't make him want it. And it says nothing about you and your worth.
Somehow to me being "rejected" by a married man who openly sees another woman in front of his children, and diverts controlled substances, addict or no, it's a felony . . . somehow it puts it all back on him, it's not your failure.
Didn't he say he wanted a divorce? What was your response then?
I think I got to the point where I would have gladly delt with the confusion of addiction rather than the pain of betrayal. Sounds silly like would you rather be blind or deaf. But seriously, the "other woman" thing almost killed me. Even to this moment. I can so totally relate. Being betrayed is worse on us than it is on anyone else. One thing that I tend to forget is that the kids are not effected in the same way I am by their father's betrayal. Their take on the situation is completley different than mine. So, even when I felt like I had lost a limb when I found out about the first affair, the children had no idea the intense pain I was suffering or what an intense scumbag their father is. They don't care in the same way we do. I know, from my own experience, that this is the worst pain I have lived thru, bar none. It is different than grieving death, it is a fear unlike anything I have ever known before and I don't know yet how to get over it. I have taken many different paths for letting go. In my mind, I let go for his sake, so that he could do it all on his own and maybe finally get well. That didn't work, but having a saint/martyr complex helped me to let go, for a bit. Then, I hated him, that helps a bit. Then, I respected his right to live his life and I tried to focus on me, my new life and all of the wonderful oppurtunities in front of me. That also helps sometimes. And then there are days like today when I just want to rage and cry and I am terrified to let go of him (him=anger,self pity,justifiactions, etc) because if I let go what will I hang on to? God? I'm still a little leary of God and my faith is running low. What will I do if my hands are free to reach out for something healthier? And what if there is nothing there? And I let go and I have nothing? And I fall and fail and am unable to get up, again? Sorry this is so long but it really hit home tonight. I am sorry you are suffering, I am sorry this has happened and I pray that you and I find peace. We both deserve it of that I am sure. Take what you like and leave the rest.
