The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
My boyfriend is in recovery. He currently lives in a sober house, but a month ago he had a relapse that I'm pretty sure he didn't tell his sponsor about.
My concern now is that he has two high stress issues going on. The first is a court hearing for child support where the issue of visitation will be brought up, and his father is very sick with a very short amount of time left to live and he's delaying the visit until after his court hearing. I know there is more to the family dynamic than he's representing to me, and I don't think I'll find out if he does relapse while home. I mean if he can lie to his sponsor he can lie to me, and surely he knows a second relapse will not go over well.
I don't know if now is the time to lay everything on the line. In part because I don't want him to have another reason to hide a relapse, but also because I wouldn't have this kind of conversation with anyone I knew in his situation even if they weren't an alcoholic. If he relapses again I want to end the relationship. I don't want to be drug through this every time he has a high stress situation. We've already discussed how he can't let his ex drive him to drinking, and from the situation he described I have a feeling that she will continue to do things that might trigger him.
He's coming to visit me tonight, and it's likely I won't see him again before he goes home. I feel myself pulling away emotionally, but I know eventually we have to talk about my boundaries and limits and needs. I'm not sure how to handle this in a rational and adult way. Do I just wait and see what happens while he is gone and bring this up when he returns or do I add more stress to his life at the very moment he doesn't need it and tell him now what I am feeling and need?
Welcome to MIP bobo - glad you found us and glad that you shared. Alcoholism is a progressive disease, which does not have a cure. One can treat the disease by seeking abstinence and some level of personal recovery. We are members of Al-Anon, which is a recovery program for family and friends who are affected by the disease in another. We practice the 12 steps for our own recovery and support each other by sharing ESH (Experience, Strength & Hope). We truly work to not give advice and allow each person to recover at their pace.
I do recommend you attend local meetings and consider recovery for you. It is in Al-Anon that I found my own sanity and courage to change the things I can - healthy boundaries that protect me without punishing others was just one gift of many recovery has brought me.
We do learn that we are powerless over others - what they do/don't do, how they act/don't act, think/don't think, etc. There is tons of help and hope in recovery - keep coming back!
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Hi there and welcome, glad you reached out.
Sounds like you have a lot running through your head at the moment with the addiction of a loved one having moved in along with the loved one. Its a real bugger that, the disease that is the third wheel to a relationship.
Alcoholism as we have come to know it in AA and Alanon is a progressive disease that effects both the drinker and the family including partners. It is cunning, baffling and powerful.
In terms of making decisions, we try not to give direct advice, but do share our Experience, Strength and Hope in recovering ourselves from the effects of a loved ones alcoholism on us. It's a demanding third wheel which can completely dominate our minds, bodies, emotions and spirits.
As a woman who has experienced a loved one with alcoholism, I can say there is a window of support and change available through alanon whenever you feel you are ready to take a look through it. There are meetings in person, online here, and literature too as well as the forum.
While its not necessary to engage with those things to participate in the forum, I'd definitely recommend meetings and literature to get a clear feel for the alanon philosophy, as well as the forum.
A good pamphlet which you may Google is called " the merry go round called denial", along with the links to the 12 steps of alanon which are on this page.
Welcome and happy reading!
I stayed with my alcoholic husband for years, often because there was a crisis looming, or a hellish event that had just happened, and I felt empathy for his dire situation and didn't want to add more problems. I used to worry and keep my feelings bottled up and eventually would explode. It wore me out!!
Eventually, I learnt to try and just stay in the moment and do what felt right for me, in the moment. Like you, I've found it helpful to take alcohol out of the equation when I'm trying to make a decision. What would I normally do?
If I make decisions like the one you are facing I now make them for myself and rarely have I needed to tell my husband what my boundary is. When I do I tell him it is so that I can authentically be myself rather than worrying about the influence my words might have on his life. I ask myself if speaking up will be helpful to me or will it cause anxiety or ruin an otherwise positive experience?
As others have said, this is a powerful and baffling disease and living alongside it has definitely affected my outlook on life. Al Anon has been an essential support network, I'm glad you found us too!
Aloha Bobosensei and welcome to the family...we are glad you found us and hope you will stick around to learn and get what we have also. There is so much information here that you can get and read and learn to help yourself. Reading your post I am reminded of just a few major tools I needed to know when I first arrived out of my marriage with a alcoholic/addict wife and while I was born and raised in the disease I still didn't know anything about it.
What I learn was acceptance and detachment and the acceptance at first was just accepting the fact of the disease and not the right or wrong of it; the morality of it I was taught. It wasn't a sin...it is a sickness and she wasn't bad she was ill as I had gotten also. With detachment I learned that I didn't cause it, couldn't control it and would not ever cure it...the 3 cees. See if that helps for the moment and come back for more. (((((hugs)))))
Thanks everyone. I'm thinking about going to therapy, but the thought of being that honest with someone scares me. I just have to make sure I'm not repeating patterns. I'm not good with confrontation, and the last years of my marriage were awful. They didn't start that way, but multiple times in was zones and being discharged from the army against his wishes set off his PTSD. I held on years longer than I should hoping he would change. We had a lot of big changes, moving back to the US from a foreign country, me starting grad school, and not knowing what the future held for him. Once I knew we were both going to be okay it still took months for us to decide to divorce. I think of all the misery I lived in for no reason, and I don't want the same thing to happen again.
I guess I also struggle with the other side of this, when you are in a relationship you sometimes give and sometimes receive. If you are always making choices in the moment based on what is best for you at that time how are you giving to the relationship? I get that it isn't mutually exclusive, that I can give and do what is right for me, but where is the balance. When do you go from being a supportive partner to enabling?
Hi and welcome!!! sounds like you have a good, realistic head on your shoulders...if it is too high maintenance and the negativity outweighs the positive, in ANY relationship, I get on the steps and ask me "ok..I'm not happy with this person, so why am I not lovingly and with a kind heart, cutting them loose???" be it permanent or temporary, I ASK me, why am I still in this situation......I can't tell you to talk to him now or wait...you know him, but if it were me, I would lay it on the line, ASAP , nicely, no mean and just tell him what I want in a relationship, what I need to do to take care of my needs for happiness, peace, mental health etc., can just say how you feel, but keep the focus on you, your feelings, etc...I would ask myself where you want to be in 6 months or a year and you already said he as an ex that is going to keep on triggering him, and stress is a part of life..if he can't deal with stress, then , without strong program work, he is on the losing end of the stick because life does not cut him a pass because he is an alcoholic....stress comes at us all...HOW we deal with it speaks volumes as to what kind of people we are gonna be in a relationship...I am working on my handling stress better...I am practicing step 3 more, and to stop fighting the energy and to be an ACTOR, not a RE-ACTOR in my own life, so I can be a healthy partner for someone if that is in my life chart...so far, I see I am a better mom, better friend, cousin, worker, etc., because I work my program and I am learning how to deal with stress better.......
WOW!! that is one heck of a good question "when do you go from being a supportive partner to enabling"??? well, for me, enabling is doing THEIR job..doing what THEY are responsible for doing..Like when I was so CoDa b4 recovery, I would call in sick for AH#1 because he was too hung over to do it....lying and covering up for him to keep peace, etc....enabling him....absorbing HIS negative problems into MY arena and suffering HIS stuff and in doing so, neglecting MY legitimate needs.....bottom line---If i dont' take care of me, noone else will..So I need to keep the focus on me, take care of me and share what I CAN with others who are not using me or wanting ME to do THEIR life work or basically "carrying their life knapsack" when THEY can do it.........being supportive is to encourage when they are trying to help themselves....healthy self care means that we take care of our needs and do self love care and we SHARE that healthy self love with others without enabling.....being supportive to an alcoholic who is in AA and working his program would be healthy support, not enabling..you're just being positive and upbeat for him...encouraging him....enabling is taking on his responsibilities, his problems, his illness, his issues, his his his stuff and making it yours....I hope this post made sense, I am exhausted today and gonna get into bed, but wanted to check in and as part of recovery , I give and receive ESH and support....
Bobo there is clinical therapy and social model...Al-Anon is a social model program where those in the program conduct the program guided by program principles and the shared experiences, strengths and hopes of others who have been changed by it. It is also free; financed by donations of the fellowship when they have and not when they don't. Please give it a 90 day try and see what happens for you...keep coming back here also as MIP is deeply supportive for those affected by the incurable disease of addiction and/or alcoholism. There are twice daily online meetings. ((((hugs))))
You have inspired some amazing responses and I think that is because you have asked some really worthwhile questions. Thank you.
Your thought about how one is giving in a relationship if one is making decisions in the moment reminds me of when I chose to make a switch from doing all I could, whenever I was asked, to considering my self-care first.
It felt very selfish to me at the time but I had been giving too much, putting AH's needs above mine. I was raised in a very considerate family where everyone helped others. That worked because it was reciprocal and it felt good to be helpful and appreciated. I did not feel worn out because it was all reciprocal. However I eventually took on a lot of the chores in my marriage and I started to feel tired and resentful. My husband blamed me for 'wearing the trousers' and said that I was disabling him, which made it all feel rather worthless.
I really wanted my husband to be healthy again but started to realise that even if he stopped drinking and started to thrive he would be coming 'home' to a worn out person who was loosing touch with her ability to have fun. That was not who I wanted to be! In addition, I could not rely on my husband to reciprocate while he was still drinking - he normally came to our relationship with problems that needed solving and by trying to be super-woman, thinking that I could smooth his path and make it all alright, I now see that I was getting in the way of him being able to deal with all aspects of his life. We became a problem focused partnership and eventually I asked myself what message I sending by thinking that I was more capable of sorting things out than he was?
Rather than relying on my husband changing I found that by letting him take responsibility for himself, whilst doing the same for myself, I had more free time to do things that enthuse and inspire me which, in turn, helped me to be a nicer person to be around!! That, for me, was a way to be more loving. Obviously, all this is simply related to my journey and it may not be relevant to your situation but thank you for inspiring this reflection on my choices - it has been helpful to look back and think it through again. ((((Hugs))))
He has more than enough reasons to stay sober - I'm sure any AA meeting will give him lots of examples of the terrible things that can and will happen if he doesn't maintain his sobriety. They are good at reminding each other of those things.
My point is that you don't have to tell him that you won't be able to take it any more and will have to separate if he relapses again. The knowledge of it wouldn't keep him more sober than the knowledge he has now - you may know the Three C's: "You didn't Cause it (drinking), you can't Cure it, you can't Control it."
So you can determine your boundary (in this case that you can't live life with an active or relapsing alcoholc any more) without telling him in advance. It wouldn't be "unfair". If you think about it, most people who leave dysfunctional relationships don't issue final ultimatums: "If you make jokes about how I'm stupid one more time, I'm leaving," or "If you roll your eyes when I'm trying to have a normal conversation one more time, I'm leaving." The last straw is never the whole reason - it's the accumulation of hurts and incompatibilities and painful things over a long period. That's the case here too. You had hoped that he would be turning a corner into a new kind of life. It looks as if he probably won't be. He's already displaying the drinking and the lying again. So you have enough or will have enough to make a decision.
I do know that hope of "Maybe if he sees how important it is to me, he would make an extra effort." But fighting addiction already requires 100% effort. He has all the motivation he needs already.
As for whether you'll know if he starts drinking again... the thing is that the nature of addiction guarantees that they can't hide it for long. So you will know. Maybe not instantly, but soon.
For me, I had to re-engineer in my mind with this program what a 'supportive partner' looks like. I had distorted views on what a relationship should look and feel like. Using the steps with a sponsor helped me to understand that a healthy relationship is two individuals who complement each other. It's not 50/50 all the time and it's not codependent.
I am supportive if I listen and empathize. I am enabling if I listen and fix without being asked. I am supportive if I provide service when asked. I am controlling if I take the reins when not asked. I am enabling if I do what they should do for self. It all became clearer as I worked the steps and practiced putting me first.
There are no perfectly right/wrong answers as each of us is different. Jerry has said many times that we should consider the desired outcome and then establish our next right action. This really helps me as well as practicing the pause so I can respond in a healthy manner instead of react to the disease.
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
So I broke up with him today. It's crazy, but I guess I sensed that things were headed in a very bad direction. While he was back home visiting his dad (who is still alive) he asked about moving in with me in December. I said yes, but that we'd need to discuss things first. He was home a week and came back. Two days after he asked about living with me he started saying he was going to take a LOA from work to help his mom with his dad during the hospice period. Given his dad had weeks left to live on the initial prognosis, I asked what he would do when he got back surely before december. He asked if he could move in sooner, November 1st now. How do you say no to that? But next thing I know he's going week to week at the sober house and then saying he isn't going to go back home to help his mom because she made him mad. My concern is mounting tension includes him finally getting supervised visitation for his kid he hasn't seen, then being a half hour late the first day of his visit, and lying about the reason why. He's running hot and cold with me. I excuse his behavior.
Long story short there are a few specific rude things he is doing I call him out on. When he comes to talk to me knowing i am upset he turns it all around on me. I realize this morning an break up with him via text. I was concerned I wouldn't be able to do it in person.
I had a work event and after a couple of beers texted him to ask if he was okay. He said he wasn't and I asked if he wanted to come see me. Knowing I had a music lesson later he said he would come tomorrow. On my way to the music lesson he starts saying what stuff he wants to get and telling me I can keep the rest unless I'm not comfortable with that then he will arrange to get it removed. Right before I got home tonight he sent me a text saying hey. I wrote back and he didn't respond. I asked if he was okay no response. I call multiple times it goes to voicemail. I text again to tell him if he's going to do something dumb to just come to my house. I woke up worried again and called. He picked up said a few things then hung up. I guess this is all attention seeking behavior and i need to stop feeding into it. I don't know if he is going to come over tomorrow or not, but I need to get myself right.
There is a sick, small part of me that wants to make up with him. The rest of me knows that he is still very, very sick and this would be the very worst thing I could do. I don't know how to handle this like a rational, sane person. Do I leave the things he wants on my porch in a sack and change the locks to my house (he has a key)? Do I make him remove everything so he has no reason to ever contact me again? What the hell is wrong with me that I let myself get into this situation?
And I do appreciate all of the replies from the first post. I read them all and have continued to think about therapy. I guess given what is going on now maybe al anon is a good idea.
Hey bobosensei - good to see you back. I resisted Al-Anon and had many reasons/justifications in my mind. I finally decided I didn't have anything to loose as I was miserable doing life on my terms. I so suggest you give it a try - I was amazed at how comforted I felt just to find a local place that was safe to share what was in my mind and heart, and never felt judged. You are not alone!
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Obviously, all this is simply related to my journey and it may not be relevant to your situation but thank you for inspiring this reflection on my choices - it has been helpful to look back and think it through again. ((((Hugs))))