bzz123 - great questions......I have allowed my sons to come back home with boundaries, rules and conditions. They've never yet been able to live up to what they committed. It has never worked and often ends badly.

My oldest has couch surfed and been able to always find a place to lay his head. He's a charmer, and very manipulative - and is the master of getting his way.

My youngest is much more introverted and stubborn. He has been homeless, in a homeless shelter, lived in a car and a few other places I have never seen so can't classify. He's the only person I know who has been asked to never return to a homeless shelter. He's not capable/willing to conform to the rules of anyone else...

Enabling to me is easily defined as doing for others what they can't do for themselves. I am always amazed that my boys did not have $$ for a meal or a home but they always had $$ for alcohol/drugs....they've worn out their welcome here and they know this. They've never been allowed to be here/live here while active. I do not allow any mind-altering substances in my home for any reason unless it's a special event - I've allowed it twice at family parties in 30 years.

That's my ESH!!

Hi bzz123,

I do not have personal experience with this, but have friends who have.  For them, it didn't end well. Their children were eventually told they needed to leave because they didn't stick to their end of the bargain.  They agree to anything in the moment and possibly believe it themselves, but don't or can't follow through.

This is such a tough spot, because we hate to think of someone we care about suffering.  Based on others' experiences, I would be very hesitant.  I also recommend meetings for ESH and support.

Ellen

I am glad you "keep coming back" and trying to work on yourself. Your post actually triggers several different but related topics for me. First, enabling, when newcomers, and seasoned people go to meetings and hear enabling, the traditional and simple definition is doing something for someone that they could do for themselves. I get that, and often that opens the door to a very slippery slope. Something they could do for themselves? Normally? But they are not able at this point? They are incapable? And so on and so on. While I was often guilty of enabling, I was far more often guilty of a different type of enabling -- contributing, and perpetuating, and playing a role in the ongoing drama, chaos, turmoil, and simply the spiraling out of control of someone else's and my life. Sounds massive, but it's not. In my experience, not enabling and detachment were partners. I had to do both. You are probably torn, and feel in a very tough spot about whether or not to do this. Believe me, I was too, and I begged people to tell me what to do. Finally, my sponsor had to really be there for me and review options for me, and explain the potential consequences of each -- to me and for me. For me to get better, this was all about me.

In my case, the alcoholic was at the point where they couldn't afford their apartment and the rent would not be paid in the coming few days. So, I had to take a long hard look at this. Not analyze and rationalize why, but a long, hard, open and honest look at the present moment. Simply put, and I don't mean to trivialize this, but the alcoholic was where they were because of them, and only them, and their decisions and actions. Period. They of course blamed others, the disease, circumstances, and so on. They had every reason why this happened, and very little of it was about anything they did. Denial. Denial. Denial. Blame. Blame. Blame. Victim. Victim. Victim. Martyr. Martyr. Martyr. I can go on. They were in the moment of experiencing the consequences and results of their own actions and decisions. Period. There were weeks of debates and arguments as to whether or not that was true -- but the fact was, that was the truth. Period. Also, when the rent didn't get paid, they were not going to be homeless. It would be several months of the rent not being paid before they were homeless. Even if it was immediate -- that didn't change the previous fact that this was a result of them. Not me, not anyone else. The closer to homeless the more motivated you become to not be homeless. Watch. That happens. For me, I learned that the alcoholic simply wants me to do what they want me to do. They want what they want and they need others to "partner" with them and be involved, and do for them...so they can keep doing what they do. If that doesn't happen -- then change occurs. Nothing changes if nothing changes...and that's about YOU.

Second, the conditions/boundaries. I hear people in meetings say conditions no, boundaries yes, and if you use those two words interchangeably, then you don't understand the difference. I used to, and I had to learn the difference. I've often said that boundaries are an "advanced" topic in al-anon. With boundaries, you truly need to "check your motives" as to what and why you are doing this. Boundaries are not -- punishment, motivation, prompting, forcing, enticement, a way to force a desired solution or result, or anything of the like. Boundaries are NOT for the other person. They are for YOU. I feel this is one of the most misunderstood tools in al-anon. A boundary is for when an alcoholic does something -- and then we do something. Like this -- when the alcoholic does this, I will do that, or I won't do that. It is not about giving something to someone with strings attached, or conditions, or terms, etc. You can develop a boundary around this type of thing, but it is not conditions. I've heard in meetings, when we give conditions, we are trying to force our will -- directly or indirectly. One can write a book on boundaries, LOL.

So, where does this leave you? Here is my suggestion -- go to as many face to face meetings as you can. Make all of this about YOU. Don't focus on HIM. Don't go to meetings looking for the answer of should I give him a place to live or how do I properly give him a place to live. Go to meetings FOR YOU. Focus on YOU. Find a sponsor, and start doing the work so that YOU can get better. Start at the beginning. Step one -- powerless and acceptance. I -- and no one else -- have no idea whether or not he will get better...but YOU can get better whether he does or not. As they say in the opening of many meetings where I attend...YOU can find contentment, even happiness, whether the alcoholic is drinking or not. When the student is ready to learn...the teacher appears. In my experience, I have found that the teacher was always there. It was just that the student had to be ready to learn...and when that happened...the student finally saw the teacher.

Keep coming back.

 

is your "person" a minor?? related to you and is a minor????  if adult?? WHY put youself into this...lets ask WHY he is facing homelessness if that happens and trust me, when they become homeless, they DO find a way to survive...on the streets or in halfway houses...Even if you were to take him in  (I would NEVER do it) but say you did..You gonna support him??? R you gonna pay his way??? clean up after him??? what if he starts a fire because he is too plastered to be careful when cooking??? what if he steals from you so to buy that next drink??? you think that won't happen???   My alcoholic brother wanted to cme here to TX and stay with me...I said AA for 5 years and be clean that five years and MAYBE....so he moved in with a good friend of ours and he ruined the friendship with his messes, his taking things w/out permission...he cheated "S" out of his share of a job they did together so he could get drunk longer on TWO pay checks.....oh yea when sober?? he is a nice guy but when he wants to get on another binge??? he will steal, cheat, do whatever, sell his soul and teh souls of his friends to get that next vodka and OJ drink ....I would NEVER give a place to live to an active alcoholic...you couldn't pay me by the hour.....and is it enabling??? of course it is...he will take advantage of your kind heart and leave you with financial ruin, maybe stolen property, not to mention a broken and bitter heart because you took him in.....WHY would you want to do that????  trust me!!  They are the best survivors in the world...the alkies and druggies...they can come up with more ways then you adn me to survive....my druggie brother manages to get fed...get high....he always finds a place to crash and sleep in his dirty, not washed for a month clothing that is so crusted his jeans could stand on their own....oh yea, he probably lives better then me in soem ways because the state gives him support $$ and also free medical, food stamps, etc....I have to WORK for my support and PAY my medical and I buy my own food with MY money that I earned working PT to suppliment my SS.....

AND who PUT him in this situation??? You??? I hardly think so..It was him...HE did this to himself...Isn't it kinder to let him reap the consequences and MAYBE get forced into recovery??? isn't it kinder for you to take care of/protect you from the kind of hardship and misery that the alcohlics bring with them when they are actively drinking...do you want to walk on egg shells in your OWN place so as to not "ruffle feathers"???  and believe me you will see the need to set a boundary, MANY boundaries on him...what are you gonna do when he gets angry at those boundaries??? toss them??  put YOUR needs on hold to soothe HIS???   Who wrote his life song???  not you!!!  HE did...So let his song play out and MAYBE if he hits the bottom hard enough, MAYBE that will drive him into recovery....if you and other kind souls hold him over, and above the abyss, he won't think he has a problem....why?? everyone is keeping him afloat so why should he bail out a boat that others are keeping afloat????? 

why buy into trouble???? if you do this , not only will it end badly most likely, but you prevent him from crashing and finding out he's got a real problem...enabling robs them of the lessons they need to hopefully walk a healthier and cleaner path.....enabling never helps...it never is positive for the giver or the taker................you are kind........be kind to you........get into the meetings, work the steps with a sponsor, take care of YOU........YOU need you.............IN SUPPORT

-- Edited by mamalioness on Thursday 3rd of August 2017 12:08:19 PM

-- Edited by mamalioness on Thursday 3rd of August 2017 12:15:31 PM

When I "rescued", my motivation was to be a hero. Did I think I was living in a child's story?

When I knew better, I did better.

Now I know if my action gets between the addict and the consequences of his behavior, I am postponing their motivation to recover. This is very simplistic, but it is my boiled-down understanding of my own behavior.

I now try to treat everyone with respect and to give them the dignity to make their own choices. It is only in hindsight when I still recognize I didn't, but I'm getting better at it.

i lived with my partner and he went from contributing to our expenses to being chronically unemployed and unable to do so.

at first i thought ok, this is temporary, of course i'll be supportive while he's looking for work. that's what partners do. but then it dragged on and on. and then i learned he was drinking. and i watched him mess up various job opportunities. and at some point it became clear that there was no real end in sight. but he had nowhere to go, and no job, and i could not get myself to make him leave until his behavior became really terrible and i was pushed to my limit. it was a very big push. mind you, i still felt love for him, attachment, and responsibility. and i still struggle with those feelings.

i knew i was enabling by making it too easy for him to live comfortably without working or functioning like a responsible adult. but it was incredibly, horribly, heartbreakingly difficult to make a change. he went into rehab and then a residential rehab facility. and he's facing a very difficult time because i removed myself as a soft place to fall, protecting him from the consequences of his behavior. honestly, it's the most difficult thing i've ever done.

note that you said you're ready for a change and to break the cycle, and your person is active. and then consider the decision again and what kind of change/impact/risk it can bring to your life. i wish you the best. and i'll join the rest in encouraging continued meetings. there's lots of experience and wisdom in the rooms.