The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
I am new here. I have been to a few AlAnon meetings in person and people were supportive, at the moment I'm in the middle of some counselling and can't attend a meeting in person but may go back afterwards. So I thought I'd join online.
I am separated from my husband who is a recovering alcoholic who attends AA and has been sober for 5 months.
I believe alcoholism is a disease and keep coming back to my wedding vow of to "love in sickness and in health" it has been his decision to separate although I have finally accepted this it is very difficult. I had become very resentful towards him due to him showing me little respect, neglecting his responsibilities at home,to the kids and in terms of contributing financially and most hurtful repeated infidelity most recently a full blown affair ..I am torn because I do think the alcoholism has caused the majority of these problems should I try and continue because he's sick the other side of it is I'm struggling to 'get over' the other women and not sure if I will ever trust him. He can probably see this and is being strong by separating and concentrating on himself-why I am struggling to do the same? It is a horrible disease. I would be interested to hear anyone's views. I hope you all have peacful days
My husband is doing the same. Not interested im anything but work and AA. He told me he cpuldn't make any rash decisions when he got put of rehab 2 months ago but has been distancing himself more and more. He was white knuckling his sobriety and not actually recovering. He lives at his mums since he got out of rehab and isn't interested in anything else. We went to visit my family for 5 days last week and he never contacted us or asked after us. So many things I wanted to share with him but he checked out. He missed our daighters first ever parent evening and never asked how it went. Never asks after the swimming and dance classes they do. I stopped contwcting him. Working on my codependency with my therapist and with the Work from Katie Byron (Google it).
Last Saturday, while I was away, he relapsed. Today is our first couples counselling and I definitrly have something to say. Recovering alcoholics don't distance themselves from their family, they are open and honest about the pain and difficulty they have. They try to rebuild a life, recovering alcoholics who become distant are going to relapse. Sorry, this is what I've learnt.
I learned that before I met my ex i had issues or flaws and these were the reasons we were attracted to each other. I had abandonment issues and so was therefore a people pleaser and that fitted with his selfishness and self centeredness. So I have came to see that the problems in our marriage were pretty much equally caused by both of us. Of course his drinking was the easiest thing to blame for all our problems. His drinking was the most obvious problem but the subtle quieter problems were just as damaging if not more because I didn't know they existed. I went to alanon before he went to aa and I was the one who ended the relationship because I was getting better and there was no way I was stepping back into a sick relationship I never felt strong enough in my recovery that it could survive with my partner still sick and not in recovery. I'm not sure if your men feel this way. Recovery is so precious but in the beginning fragile. If you have not entered your own recovery then returning to the relationship could be a major risk to their sobriety and if they suffer from a life threatening disease then it may be a sensible decision. It doesnt make it any easier to understand this. The hurt and pain of this disease is almost unbearable but its a family disease and the family need recovery. You need recovery for yourself. Then whatever happens whether you get back or split for good it will be ok because tour life and happiness isn't dependant anymore on another human.
Welcome Rose I do so understand your position. I too worried about my vows and reasoned that since alcoholism was a disease, I needed to overlook all the terrible events and proceed with honoring my marriage vows.
My alanon sponsor urged me to keep using the alanon program in order to recover from the negative affects of living with the disease so that I could then make an informed decision regarding my marriage. I am glad I did because the effects of living with the disease are life long. Today because of the steps, slogan and meetings I can honestly say that the pain caused by this disease no longer haunts me and i am able to live life on life's terms. I urge you to give alanon another try and keep coming back here as well. There is hope.
Rose take what you like and leave the rest. Alanon tools can provide alternatives. We can take actions to protect ourselves while still attempting to recover from the devastating effects of the disease.
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The Steps , slogans and meetings helped me to come to terms with my anger and resentments and love again. There is help and hope .
Good morning Rose and welcome to MIP. I am glad you found us and glad that you shared. I too encourage you to lean into Al-Anon recovery as well as necessary outside resources to help you find your peace and your path. I found Al-Anon at a point of extreme rage, despair and complete chaos and am grateful for the path it's brought me to.
There are no easy answers and each person and each relationship is different. Al-Anon did give me the tools I needed to be happy and serene in spite of what others were/were not doing. Keep coming back - there is hope and help in recovery! (((Hugs)))
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
I am so sorry for your confusion and pain because infidelity hurts for a number of reasons and after a number of years there is some of what my X did that I won't justify what he did .. I see it differently now. We were both miserable in the disease his was drinking directly and mine was the affects of his drinking. We did not like or love each other in a healthy way .. I think we did based upon our views of love at the time which were def not healthy.
Ironically for me it was the cheating that did our marriage in not the drinking and he had a full blown affair that he still denies which I wonder what the point of that is .. LOL. He will not see that is his part and I don't need to worry about it. That's the blessing of Alanon is putting my health mental/emotional/spiritual health right .. and that's whatever those things mean to me. If an addict has a 4 fold disease meaning they are spiritually, mentally and emotionally bankrupt .. some are physically as well .. I was into the bankruptcy 3 fold. I had to remember who I was meant to be .. which is a huge freedom from whatever my XAH is or isn't doing, we have kids together that I have raised to the best of my ability.
The whole issue of STD's is a very big issues especially given the fact that some of the STD's are not curable and when people are in an altered state of mind do not think to practice safe sex .. DO get yourself tested you will have peace of mind that you are healthy and what I don't agree with any cheating situation is putting someone else's sexual health at risk .. I don't care if they are addicts or not .. it is not anyone's right to do that to another living human being especially someone they are suppose to "love". One of the best quotes and I do not know who says it however .. Love doesn't hurt. It really is that simple and some people don't know what love really is and how to give or receive it. That is a learning process that if it's corrupted hurts that emotional growth.
I do hope you will keep coming back .. and figure out what is right for you .. you have a right to be physically safe though and that's not anything anyone has a right to take from you.
Hugs S :)
__________________
Faith minus vulnerability and mystery equals extremism. If you've got all the answers, then don't call what you do "faith". - Brene Brown
"Whatever truth you own doesn't own you" - Gary John Bishop
I learned that before I met my ex i had issues or flaws and these were the reasons we were attracted to each other. I had abandonment issues and so was therefore a people pleaser and that fitted with his selfishness and self centeredness. So I have came to see that the problems in our marriage were pretty much equally caused by both of us. Of course his drinking was the easiest thing to blame for all our problems. His drinking was the most obvious problem but the subtle quieter problems were just as damaging if not more because I didn't know they existed. I went to alanon before he went to aa and I was the one who ended the relationship because I was getting better and there was no way I was stepping back into a sick relationship I never felt strong enough in my recovery that it could survive with my partner still sick and not in recovery. I'm not sure if your men feel this way. Recovery is so precious but in the beginning fragile. If you have not entered your own recovery then returning to the relationship could be a major risk to their sobriety and if they suffer from a life threatening disease then it may be a sensible decision. It doesnt make it any easier to understand this. The hurt and pain of this disease is almost unbearable but its a family disease and the family need recovery. You need recovery for yourself. Then whatever happens whether you get back or split for good it will be ok because tour life and happiness isn't dependant anymore on another human.
Mahalo el-cee for this post. It so reminds me what I had to learn when I got to Al-Anon and college and the other places I stopped over on in order to get my head and heart and behaviors right. I say often that when I first arrived at the doors of recovery that I didn't know and didn't even know that I didn't know what alcoholism was and still I was born and raised in it.
I will not add to your post. It stands very well on it's own and I feel it should be read and accepted by all who need to know. Again Mahalo. ((((hugs))))
Thank you all for your posts..it means a lot to feel connected to others who can understand where I am coming from.
I know that I have many flaws, as we all do as human beings. I will carry on trying to be the best person I can and try and accept that that is what my ex is also doing. I do need to think of it as recovery for me and work on it. It's hard to explain my head is so confused. I have been told I don't know what love is by him but I know deep down I have a great capacity for love. It is very hard to connect with someone fully when they have an addiction and when you have been repeatedly betrayed even if it whilst they are under the influence. As much as I want to forgive it all, and I don't lay the collapse of the marriage completely at his feet, I feel utterly exhausted.
I love what others have shared. I, too, stayed because of my marriage vows. What I realized was that I had to pray that I was letting go of My will and turning it over to a higher power. You don't have to forgive immediately. Your relationship didn't fall apart in one day and you won't be able to let go of resentments and past hurts until you start the healing process for yourself. It takes time. Be gentle on yourself.
In all relationships, whether this is addiction or infidelity or whatever, there are always 2 people involved. I learned through program that I wasn't owning my part and it made me see my ex husband in a better light. It didn't save our marriage, but it did give me the strength to leave with dignity and grace and knowing I had perfect peace. I also, at times, had perfect peace in staying put and waiting for things to unfold. Life isn't a race, but it is short and we only get one to live. Recovery is a beautiful place for you to learn more about yourself and can give you the tools to heal yourself and hopefully, your marriage.
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Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
Forgiveness is a process and I find that when I rush the process the stuff bubbles up in other areas of my life ... the other trick about forgiveness it works best for me when I forgive myself first .. I have a greater capacity to forgive others. I encourage you to be extremely gentle with yourself .. forgiveness doesn't mean condoning what happened .. sorry two people .. sometimes one person is on the left side of wrong .. sometimes that person is me. Just for a min breathe and just be where you are instead of rushing around being where anyone else thinks you should be.
I imagine you are exhausted and the best place to start is to fill your own cup of healing first .. your x is going to do what he's going to do .. you are not required to fill his cup when there is nothing left to give. I remember how exhausted and excessive energy I wasted on my XAH .. it's not to say he wasn't worth it .. however .. when was it my turn to put that kind of effort into myself. Alanon really does help fill that cup first.
Big hugs .. S :)
__________________
Faith minus vulnerability and mystery equals extremism. If you've got all the answers, then don't call what you do "faith". - Brene Brown
"Whatever truth you own doesn't own you" - Gary John Bishop
I so agree that forgiveness is a process. I have discovered that truly everything begins with me. I am better able to accept others when I accept me - flawed and human. I am better able to love others when I love myself and know who I am, just for today. Same applies with forgiveness, respect, kindness, etc. When I am practicing a spiritual life, and being gentle and kind to myself, it becomes a new habit and flows more naturally over time.
So - in Al-Anon, when we suggest keeping the focus on self, it's so we can become the best person possible to ALL - self and others. I struggled with forgiveness, and like suggested, my resentments often bubbled back up when I rushed with my processing. One quote that really helped me was in the signature of a person who used to post here often -
"Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown ~~Debbie
This spoke deeply to me each time I saw it and helped me realize what forgiveness really is.
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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene
Welcome Rose...if you go to face to face, conference approved alanon meetings, you will be in the right place, a safe place...you will be in a place where many of the people there will have felt what you are feeling, and they will have gone through what you are going through. So, they've been there, they understand. While that should offer you comfort, just know that you are not alone.
That said, where you are right now is not an easy place, physically, mentally, or otherwise. I struggled with the same thing, the exact same thing. Every road, every thoughts, every conversation and comment led me back to...divorce is not an option. Not for me. Not for who I am. It was absolutely and completely foreign to me. I am a man of integrity, dignity, class, and while that means the world to me, it had very little to do with the situation I was in. Why? Because logic no longer applied to my life, my wife, or the situation. I could not apply, rely or use logic to an illogical person and situation. There was nor normal, healthy, stable thinking for my wife at that point.
While I finally got a handle on this part of it, what became insurmountable was the part where my wife became very indifferent, negligent and completely ignoring our family life, responsibilities, and having no desire to even acknowledge any of it. Now listen, I completely get you have to spend 24/7, 100% laser precision focus on staying clean and sober...but...to be mean? Disrespectful? Degrading? It took an effort on her part to do this...she could have just as well been indifferent. But an effort to be nasty? OK, I get it, it is part of the disease. I get it. I do. Really. However, cheating? You don't want to be with me, with your family, you don't love me, feel feelings of connection, marriage, love, and so on...but you can be with someone else? You can feel you want someone else, be wanted by someone else? OK, I get it, it doesn't make sense, it is part of the disease, part of the sickness; and I also get that she was vulnerable, not stable, fragile, etc. I get it. I really do.
I've heard people debate -- the alcohol made her do these things, this is not her, alcoholism caused this, and so on and so on. I've heard the other side too. And here is my answer...and it doesn't make sense to many people...it's not about her...it's about ME. I will leave you with that at this point. No one can tell you how to feel. There are "deal breakers" for me and they may not be "deal breakers" for anyone else. Alcoholism is a very enigmatic, baffling, cunning, insidious, progressive, decimating, and confusing disease. This, if there is anything, is personal, to the person who is going through it. Others can give you guidance, support, advice, what worked for them, what didn't, their experience, and so much more. But, in the end, it comes down to you, what you feel, want, can live with, can't live with, how you want to live your life, and so on.
All the best.
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Bo
Keep coming back...
God, grant me the serenity...to accept the PEOPLE I cannot change...the courage to change the ONE I can...and the wisdom to know it's ME...
