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Post Info TOPIC: Advice Giving, AlAnon Principles/Traditions, and Group Unity


~*Service Worker*~

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RE: Advice Giving, AlAnon Principles/Traditions, and Group Unity


 

  No, nobody was critical of Paul- least of all me...

   it might come down to my rural habits- a vote of thanks to the chair. Paul started the thread and led through it. A form of service to the group...

  and thanking him simply for his service... aww...



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~*Service Worker*~

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Great tradition David Thanks

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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


Senior Member

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I've never seen those guidelines before. Where are they posted?

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I don't see the message/guidelines on the mobile version of the board, I don't think they're there in this version. This might be something to adress. I know I mostly use MIP from my mobile.

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~*Service Worker*~

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They are found at the bottom of the page when you click to reply or post a new topic-under "submit post "

 



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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


~*Service Worker*~

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Just FYI, if you use the 'quick reply' (which I always do), they do not show up. I rarely use mobile so don't know if they appear when responding there or not.

I will readily admit that I've only removed spam posts (trolls that sign up to 'sell' or 'solicit'). I have edited language (cursing) only. I know that members have asked for posts to be removed typically for privacy reasons. Beyond that, I support 'free-flow' writing, thinking, processing.

I've been involved in other forums where the moderators do more 'control'. It can quickly become a 'job' --- one that doesn't appeal to me at all.

So - depending upon how you reply and on what tool you use, these may not be 'easily seen'.....

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Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging.  Pause before assuming.  Pause before accusing.  Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret.  ~~~~  Lori Deschene

 

 



Senior Member

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They don't show on the mobile site, and the "The material presented here etc" bit isn't there either. It simply says "al-anon family groups" and then displays the posts so someone only logging in via mobile (as many do) would logically assume this site is the official face of al-anon. And as it is such a popular site, it would possibly be the first one they encounter when searching for an al-anon discussion board.
Additionally, I've never noticed the guidelines link before; it isn't at all prominent and I doubt many people notice or read it. It doesn't appear when you "quick reply" as I am doing now for example.
Personally I think that is problematic and this aspect of the current issue could be addressed with a sticky post containing all of that information (the sticky posts DO appear on the mobile site and would be noticeable).

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~*Service Worker*~

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Great Idea I will copy and paste.
in addition I will include the alanon closing statement:To those of you who have not been with us long

You may not like all of us but you will come to love us in a special way the same way we already love you" talk to each other reason things out with each other but let there be no gossip or criticism of one another instead let the understanding love and peace of the program grow in you one day at a time.

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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


Senior Member

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Great Betty, I believe that helps to clarify things. Thank-you

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~*Service Worker*~

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aww



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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud
a4l


~*Service Worker*~

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Thanks Betty. I think that's great too.

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~*Service Worker*~

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                   smile...



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~*Service Worker*~

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Glad that it might help.   Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts.



-



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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


Senior Member

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Date:

Beyond that, I support 'free-flow' writing, thinking, processing.
************************************************

and THIS is why I came back here...I lurked for a while, tested the waters, listened to my inner HP....Liked what I saw...Missed the ones I had connected with in the past......we have GR8 moderators who let me be me, do me, speak my truth , walk my path, work my program, progress on some stuff , struggle with other stuff and I am NOT alone...

I've been on boards where it was overkill on censorship and control which was outright bullying.....I packed up my toys and left....Boundaries, common courtesies, YES!!!!! control/censorship that takes away ones rights to grieve, vent, process, heal,etc....NO!!!!!!! JUST saying

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Rose:

*** KEEP IT SIMPLE***



~*Service Worker*~

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Since one of the principles of the program is that we do not give advice because we believe that the answers for each person's life lives within that person Sharing how the tools worked/ are working in our lives is what I believe program is all about. This sharing reinforces our own recovery within ourselves and provides hope and encouragement to all.
We all walk a delicate line on the Board. In alanon we are asked to share our ESH in order to solve our common problems. At my meetings the" no cross talk" rule applies and each member's share stand on its own.
On the Board sharing our own. recovery and the tools that worked for us is extremely helpful and i encourage everyone to be mindful of the alanon principles and to continue sharing.



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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


~*Service Worker*~

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I agree Betty - this thread, some of the perceptions and some of the responses brought to my mind the three obstacles to success in Al-Anon...

Obstacles to Success in Al-Anon:

All Al-Anon discussions should be constructive, helpful, loving and understanding. In striving toward these ideals. we avoid topics that can lead to dissension and distract us from our goals.

1. Discussions of Religion: Al-Anon is not allied with any sect or denomination. It is a spiritual program, based on no particular form of religion. Everyone is welcome, no matter of what affiliation or none. Let us not defeat our purpose by entering into discussions concerning specific religious tenets.

2. Gossip: We meet to help ourselves and others to learn and use the Al-Anon philosophy. In such group therapy, gossip can have no part in program. We do not discuss members of others, and particularly the alcoholic; our dedication to anonymity gives people confidence in Al-Anon. Careless repeating of matters heard at meetings can defeat the very purpose for which we are joined together.

3. Dominance: Our leaders are chosen not to govern, but to serve. No member of Al-Anon should direct, assume authority or give advice. Our program is based on suggestion, interchange of experience, rotation of leadership. Each person makes progress in his or her own way and pace. Any attempt to manage or direct is likely to have disastrous consequences for group harmony.

As I process Paul's original share, the responses in this thread and the traditions of the program, I admit I see all sides....Yet, I too would prefer members err on the side of caution/kindness instead of domination/orders.

Make it a great day everyone....may peace and joy surround you as you go about your day!

__________________

Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging.  Pause before assuming.  Pause before accusing.  Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret.  ~~~~  Lori Deschene

 

 



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I really am sensitive to the no crosstalk rule because growing up it was NOT safe for me to share, not even to FEEL....here I can post my feelings, whether some, all agree or disagree with me, they don't "come at me" with the machete of a shaming tongue....been there...won't go there again....I haven't seen it hear as yet and for that I am grateful.....i like what Iamhere said as well...the 3 obstacles to alanon......I have have actually GONE to face to face alanon meetings and to my horror they were using the scriptures heavy on the 12 steps and it was clear it was "only Christians need apply" All others will be "converted" and that was made clear...... I walked out....I guess you could say I was assaulted with points 1. and 3, respectively.

I think this post of Paul was great..I see it as bringing us together as fellow travelers who , yea, have differing feelings about SOME things, but I note.....we ALL care about the program and the safety and harmony of this great group here...I may not "like" everyone here, but I love the spirit of them adn the fact that they are HERE...Striving for a better way of thinking as I am...I will never ever please everyone, and I am not trying to, but I do hope that as one little member in this large group, I have a safe place to bring my recovery ups and downs and just be a part of the team...

When I was on "leave", I pondered where is my place in the scheme of recovery..Where to I belong.....I came to the conclusion that I DO belong here..I belong ANYwhere I go, so long as I keep the focus on me, let others figure out their own solutions, yea, give my ESH and then let it go....encourage them with a hug, not a sledgehammer....in the past , I think I did get "heavy handed" and I apologize to the ones, IF and WHEN I did that...It was 10000% from a good heart which I know I have, but still, I erred....I will never walk on cracked egg shells but I have learned to "tone it down" a bit, even though I know what the safe thing to do is, it is up to THEM to figure it out, work it out on THEIR time table, never mine....I did learn that....I hope that ANYone on this board who felt that I was "too pushy" too "coming on strong" can forgive an honest, sincere, out of a good heart "boo boo" made out of genuine concern......I am FREE , now, to stick wth MY issues...MY experiences..MY solutions to MY issues and let the others do the same.....

I guess I learned all this , dealing with my adopted daughter who likes to emotionally "slap me down" "Yank the controls of the roller coaster" she had me on....I felt like that child picking the petals off a flower "she loves me--she loves me not" I QUIT trying to figure her out....the last time I saw her I apologized for trying to "force" her to do what is right and to treat me with respect...if it is not in her, it is HER lesson to learn and all I can do is take care of me...I told her I appreciated the lessons she taught me, inknowing what is IN my control, what is OUT of my control and I hugged her and said, "i'll be around to see the grandkids when they are home, but I leave you to figure out life and whats best for you as i act upon what is best for me-----and that is keeping contact with you at a , yes, KIND, but also keeping my distance.....

I raised her up...taught her all I knew to share...shared my mistakes with her so maybe she would not repeat....I gave her the best "send off" I could...She didn't appreciate me...loves her A dad, but takes out her hostility on me in a passive aggressive way....I let it go on...My lesson.....I also , last year, when I got my eye surgery and she stood me up, last minute when I was DUE for my surgery and NEARLY missed my appointment (dept. of safety was HOLDING my drivers license, pending my cataract surgery---No license--No ability to work and care for me----this was not minor..this was my right to drive) she stood me up...last minute I had to get my boss to take me....how embarrassing to have to call my BOSS, who is a dear, to take me for my 2nd eye......it all worked out because #1, I did'nt trust her to not mess me up...#2, i gave my boss a heads up , she may diss me and wold he help me if I was in need??? he said OF COURSE #3 I never put my eggs in one basket...#4, i had and have even more ZERO expectations of this girl

so it worked out....she calls me waaay later that evening "i'm cooking supper, you want me to bring you some??? I thought of the cold dinner she brought to me when i had bronchitis , where she promised my doctor she would look after me , check in on me (at the time she lived next door) and she abandoned me ...anyway, I told her "no thanks...I would rather you not come around as my bestie across the street is feeding me a nice supper with my own home made oatmal cookies and thanks but no thanks"

since that incident I have really minimized my contacts with her...I am happier...more peaceful....I took her toy away from her and I took me back.....

I know this post is WAY off topic, but I am sitting here thinking of all the lessons she taught me and those lessons, I thanked her for when I hugged her and left and basically said "goodbye for the most part" to, and i have brought those lessons here to this board.....LIVE and LET live, even tho, common sense, you know the other is shooting their foot...its their foot...their right to put holes in it......also she taught me that to enable or force another is to rob them of the lessons THEY need to grow...take that next step torwards evolving to a higher awareness.....she also taught me the art of detachment without rancor.....I have had a LOT of practice with detachment, thanks to her, LOL but it still was a lesson....now, when I briefly see her in playing with the grandkids, she is kept at a KIND distance from me.........
I forgive her because she knows not what she does----- to herself

I forgive me for my mistakes were all part of my growing into a healthier person...I forgive my mistakes with her....with my tenure on this board inthe past.....why??? because I meant well and I know my good heart....AND I am honest, open and willing so therefore, I SHALL progress......

thanks for letting me do this long share....this year has been PACKED with grief and loss and death and other unwanted events...I am having trouble staying in my body, staying in the moment, sleeping good, having a lot of trouble to stay hopeful and positive of the future.....I find myself, now, fighting off situational depression that is knocking on my door...I will MAKE myself get out today, visit my bestie who is moving (another sad loss for me) and I will play tennis, shoot some hoops and LOOK for fun and frolik and make the best of this day by putting out my best energy............

PEACE to everyone!!!!!!

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Rose:

*** KEEP IT SIMPLE***

a4l


~*Service Worker*~

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Posts: 749
Date:

I have come to conclude a group can only be as healthy as its members. And ultimately, a member is only as healthy as the strength of their programme. Its very much an individual honesty thing. Just as the true laws ought be in a (hu) mans heart, and stupidity can't be legislated against, one can't really dictate anothers recovery in the name of anti-dictating recovery practices. My program also says have faith in the higher power because whatever happens, happens as it is meant to. It would be a shame to lose this cyber space of fellowship.

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"When one door is closed, don't you know,another is open?" Bob Marley.



~*Service Worker*~

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Posts: 14806
Date:

I agree A41 Well said

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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud
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