Al-Anon Family Group

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.

Members Login
Username 
 
Password 
    Remember Me  
Post Info TOPIC: Who I can and cannot talk too


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 24
Date:
Who I can and cannot talk too


When my AH was first arrested for public intoxication - while with our three children - I spoke with his father. We talked about our mutual concernand support for AH.  I felt that he was a good resource because his first wife - my AH's mother - was an alcoholic.

 

A few days later when my AH spoke, I didnt keep the conversations with his father a secret. I didnt feel as though I had a reason to. AH is beyond upset that I spoke with my father n law. He felt as if I didnt have the right to reach out to him. He asked me to consider his feelings next time I think about talking to his father...

 

Fast forward five weeks. My father in law and I chat because he hadn't heard from AH and just wanted to know that all was ok.  I briefly explained that I was proud of the obvious effort AH was putting into his treatment program. I had explained that it keeps him pretty busy...he then asked about the charges against him. We spoke a bit about the possible outcomes of a DUI, Public intoxication,  and three children endangerment charges....nothing which is a secret...

 

I havent heard the end of it since AH heard of our talk. He is livid that I spoke to his father or anyone about this!! I understand he is upset and under a lot of stress....but seriously, if I cant talk to family who I respect and trust, I am going to go insane keeping all of this inside. 

 

Sigh - thanking for listening or reading this far.

 

Early Bird

 

 



__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 11569
Date:

(((Early Bird))) - hugs to you - you are in a difficult spot it sounds. So sorry for that.

It is at times like this where working your program will help you find answers. I have found in my own situation no good comes from talking about one of my A(s) to another of them. It just doesn't result in anything good. I do most of my sharing and processing with neutral 3rd parties - my sponsor and/or my program friends.

Just work your program and your truth will be revealed.

Prayers and positive thoughts sent your way!

__________________

Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging.  Pause before assuming.  Pause before accusing.  Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret.  ~~~~  Lori Deschene

 

 



~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 17196
Date:

To answer your question I found I can talk to Alanon members, at alanon meetings,or my sponsor because they will respect the anonymity of my share . I can never talk about my partner to others, as that would be considered gossip. 
If my partner's dad wants information on his son he should be asked to speak to his son about this .



__________________
Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 934
Date:

This is interesting to me because sharing with family is not always gossip. It depends on the family dynamic. Healthy families share and communicate (out in the open) I have found that this is a slippery slope in the program because sometimes not sharing is keeping secrets in the family as well. I understand sharing with a neutral third party to get perspective, however I also understand as soon as you stop sharing who you are relationships suffer. I know this is the concept of detaching with love...so you don't put up a wall. However, I have seen this way to many times where people in program say it is gossip when they are actually putting up a wall and giving only program people a window.

__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 5663
Date:

It's a slippery slope. I personally would encourage him to talk to his own son about things, but also wouldn't shy away from certain discussions. Just make sure your motives are clear. Alcoholics have shame and they want you to keep their secrets. In that secrecy, the disease festers. So...to me, if he has shame over his actions, the answer would be for him to suck it up and stop doing things he is ashamed of people finding out about. That is a grown up response. The whole "I can't believe you told so and so.....!!!" is like a teenage response.

__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 11569
Date:

This is a great discussion and one I wrestled with due to 3 qualifiers. I tend to error more like Betty as even with the purest of motives, discussion of loved ones has brought about grief.

My sponsor told me that their events, actions, etc. are not my story to tell. Period. And, it made sense to me. It is true that "Secrets keep us sick", but for my program, it is my secrets, not another person's secrets.

We are far from a healthy family, and with 3 A(s), you can imagine how badly communication can be. I tried to be the glue, and they all formed a habit of, Tell Dad.... and my AH would say, Tell ASon 1..... This was easy stuff like change the oil, pick up the garage and more complicated stuff - emotions, anger, etc. Well - as you can imagine, this certainly added to my illness in trying to keep the peace and keep everyone up to date.

As I got better and worked the program, I developed the ability to say with love, Feel free to tell Dad that your self honey, I am busy. They all stopped using me as a conduit and their communication suffers, but it's easier as they boys aren't living with us any longer. It's not my job to make sure they speak, they share and/or they know what is going on. My oldest ASon relapsed recently, and shared that with me. I openly said that it was his story to tell and share as he wanted, and that I was not telling his brother or dad. I don't know if he shared it with them or not as we no longer discuss each other with another.

What works for one family may not work for another. In mine, it works best to stay on my side of the street and speak my truth only.

__________________

Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging.  Pause before assuming.  Pause before accusing.  Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret.  ~~~~  Lori Deschene

 

 



Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 210
Date:

Wow...this sounds very familiar...as in been there done that. I hope you will find peace.

What I have found helps me is that I now tell AH (now in recovery just about 2 1/2 months) that I will not be told who I can and can not speak to about whatever I choose. I respect that this is his issue and try not to gossip or spread any negative information, however, I fee, talking to my family (he has very little family and we don't see any of them) is my business. I have feelings and as long as his actions affect me, I am entitled to feel any way I so choose and to discuss those feelings as I see fit.

This has not always been the case, as before I really understood about AA and AlAnon, I did (in retrospect) say way too much to way too many people about things that were none of my business. I try very hard NOT to do that now! I have always shared too much because I honestly hate secrets and feel they destroy you from the inside out.

I have learned that not sharing information that is not mine to share is not keeping a secret though....it is respect....for him, for our relationship, and for me. There are boundaries I do not cross now.

I honestly believe that a great deal of help can be found in the pages of the AA and AlAnon literature on this subject (and so many others). I also believe that keeping true secrets is not good and that we must honestly inventory our own actions (as well as those of the people we are involved with....emotionally or socially). I use the thought process here that a person will do in public only what they are extremely comfortable doing...so if a person does things that concern you in public, you should be very, very concerned about what they do in private....because it is usually a magnification of what is done in public many, many times over....

****Please note that this is just MY opinion and not advice on your situation in any way****

I do know, however, that A's often believe that they are keeping their drinking a secret and that nobody really thinks they are an A until they start working the program. It's funny to me how my A always thought he "had the cat by the tail" so to speak and had everyone else fooled. Of course everyone already knew he was an A....how could they not??????slurred speech, loud brash talking, never drinking in front of coworkers, but always having the odor of alcohol coming from the pores...and let's never forget the really dark sunglasses and constant closed beverage container in the hand....or beer can in every photo for 30 plus years.......,yep, I'm willing to bet he wasn't too good at keeping that a real secret. He was the only one who didn't know he was an A. Everybody else already knew and was already talking about it.

I pray you find peace and that serenity will come your way soon.

__________________

There, but for the Grace of God, go I.



~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 2200
Date:

Thank you for posting your question, I am interested in the replies you've received.

I found that it was quite important for me to be able to speak freely and to respect my own judgement about what I said or didn't say and to whom. I think that it is easy to go from secrecy to isolation. I sought advice from my husband's brother during a tricky spell. I can understand how that upset my husband because it meant disclosing something that he was not proud of, but I also think that if we choose to cover up for someone's shameful behaviour it takes away a key reason for the behaviour to stop.



__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 1896
Date:

HI earlybird,

It sounds like FIL doesn't yet trust his son to give him the whole picture. This isn't uncommon, you probably have the same issues yourself, I certianly did. When my wife first was in recovery my MIL got much of her news from me, but eventually she got weaned back onto getting her news from my wife.

I would encourage him to talk to his son to get news but, if he asks you questions, I don't see why you shouldn't answer at least most of them. It's up to you to navigate that slope that pinkchip talked about. You might also suggest Al Anon to his dad.

Kenny

__________________


Senior Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 339
Date:

Yes this is a difficult spot and I agree that you had to be able to talk to someone in his family about this. I reached the point where I had to bring family members in with my AH but I didn't tell him at first as I knew he would be mortified that a close relative knew. I did inform him a few weeks ago and he was more ashamed than mad. He did have a very good conversation with his uncle (pretty much a dad to him) so I am glad a told a family member about what was going on. Give him time as his anger may be coming from a place of embarrassment. I know for my AH he was more embarrased as he is a very private person and it was hard for him to admit to others that he had a problem. Best to you and your husband.

__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 1020
Date:

To me, it would have been like announcing someone is overweight. How do they hide either one? So I didn't.
Anyone in their life knew what was going on, even though he tried to convince himself it was under control and nobody knew. Ugh that whole jumble!
I seriously safeguard the anonymity of people I know in program. By extension, I don't discuss anyone's drinking or using. I assume when it's addiction it's obvious. If it isn't - not my problem.

__________________


Veteran Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 73
Date:

Hi Early Bird,

Sounds like a very difficult situation.

I eventually likened XAW's drinking to abuse against me. She
disappeared, I didn't know where she was, I worried, I was left
with the kids, I was left to hold things together, whatever I was
doing in my life had to stop so I could attend to that, etc. Then
she'd come home, we'd talk it through, and everything would
be okay. For so long I didn't tell anyone because we (yes, "we."
That was part of her manipulation, I would later understand)
didn't want to risk having the stigma of an alcoholic wife, family,
etc.

This would happen roughly once per month.

I believe abuse perpetuates in large part because it remains
behind closed doors. For this reason, I eventually told her
family members because I figured they would want to know
and would be concerned about her (they were). Later I
started telling my family. Then I started telling close friends.
I needed support.

I later viewed this through the "alcoholism" glasses rather
than abuse glasses and started taking it less personally.

I do think Al-Anon members can most definitely be an outlet.
If you want to tell friends and family though then my personal
belief is that you are able to especially in the best interests
of your own mental health/sanity.

Thanks for sharing.

Mark

__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 1887
Date:

I used to discuss my A with his mother and brothers. They always seemed very concerned and caring and would call and ask me for reports etc. He would become very angry if he knew about t so I felt uneasy about it but sometimes I had to talk to someone and I felt his family were "safest" because they care about him and want the best for him right?
It really didn't make me feel good, it caused a lot of grief with A and in the end his family did not help in any way and instead I ended up feeling like his "case manager" with them showing no interest whatsoever in me or my child and just calling to demand information about him and to tell me what they thought I should do to help him. It got ridiculous with his mother calling to give me hour long lectures about what I should be doing to help him (rationing his beers for him, making him smoothies, cooking him certain foods, encouraging him to get "out more"...useless stuff. I got very sick of hearing about what they thought I should be doing to "fix" him. In the end when I started detaching and refusing to "manage" him they turned on me and his mother stated to disclose our conversations to him. I regret it. I wish I'd known about al-anon years earlier and kept my discussions confidential and amongst people with care for MY wellbeing.



-- Edited by missmeliss on Friday 26th of June 2015 12:43:26 PM

__________________

If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)



~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 13696
Date:

 

 

The best direction I received was from in the rooms with the fellowship and more so with my sponsor.  If you do not have a sponsor yet I suggest you find one...some one with time and experience and keep coming back to the MIP well cause there is so much ESH here it's wonderful.     (((((hugs))))) smile  By the way alcoholics have very very weak egos...expect the poor meeeeees when their egos are pinched.  I assume he was arrested in public which was his doing and so he left a bigger smudge on his pride and ego than you have.   (((((hugs))))) smile



__________________


~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 1091
Date:

This is a great topic, and one I have been struggling with myself.

years ago, I did reach out to my mother-in-law about a concern I had. She immediately told my wife, and we had a huge fight. That resulted in me just not talking to anyone about anything related to my wife or her drinking, which resulted in isolation for me.

For me, right now, I have settled on sharing openly with AnAnon members, and refusing to answer direct questions from family and friends dishonestly. Am I overweight? yes. Do I have a black dog? yes. Is my wife an alcoholic? yes. I do not want to live my life dishonestly, and I will not hide the truth about my wife if I am asked directly. (Which means, if her mom asks me if she was drinking, I say "I don't know, I was not with her.") And, I also won't bring up the topic with family and friends, because it is her journey and her story to tell, not mine. I am becoming more comfortable with saying: that is something that ma wife should share with you / that is a question that my wife should answer. That way, I am not being dismissive, and I am not being dishonest, and I don't have to keep track of which tall tale which person knows, and I let my wife take responsibility for sharing her own story.

Thanks for sharing.

__________________

Skorpi

If you are depressed, you are living in the past. If you are anxious, you are living in the future. If you are at peace, you are living in the present. - Lao Tzu



~*Service Worker*~

Status: Offline
Posts: 1152
Date:

The result of not talking/telling is more isolation for us..... that is manipulation that the alcoholic uses. I did not tell. I was manipulated. I was also resentful and angry. I was isolated.

When he got his DUI I refused to take his call from jail to come and get him. He had enough money in his pocket to post bail. I let him talk to the answering machine. I finally called his brother who had been in AA for 10 years by then. My BIL was very surprised. He said he never saw it. When I told him I was waking up at 2 and 3 AM and finding the hubby in his chair in the living room sipping whiskey in the middle of the night he believed me that it had gone too far. He went to the jail at 5 AM and took him to coffee and a talk. Yes, the hubby was a bit upset that I didn't keep his "secret" but that was more manipulation. I went into AlAnon after that and I had a lot of anger to get over.

You do what is best for YOU. That is what we do in AlAnon. Take care of yourself. Live by the Golden Rule but don't be manipulated into something that someone else wants. This is about making you feel better. Gradually you will be able to get the two of them talking but don't conceal the truth from either of them.



__________________
maryjane


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 22
Date:

That's a really tough call. I get that it's my husband's journey and all, but it's still a family disease that effects me deeply as well. I did get in to some trouble recently with my AH when his brother confronted him about his drinking and made it pretty obvious that we had spoken about it. I got a lecture about how this is "our business" and how we shouldn't invite people outside of our relationship in to our problems. I saw his point, but his brother pointed out that he has been aware that my husband has a problem for some time, so I didn't really tell him anything he didn't already know. He just wanted to voice his concerns to my husband, make him aware that he wasn't fooling anyone, and let him know that people were worried.

I'm still not sure what to think about the situation. I guess I don't think that any party involved was particularly right or wrong. I did learn a few things from this, though. First of all, if I ever decide to talk about it to family again, I have to be very careful which family members I confide in. It's good that I picked my husband's emotionally stable brother and not someone like my MIL, who is an emotionally unstable, manipulitive enabler. Had I told her what was going on, I would have opened myself up to a world of hurt. I would have been picked apart and blamed for his drinking. For me, the idea behind disclosing something like alcoholism is to feel less isolated and more supported. There are many people in an alcoholic family, some obvious and some very subtle, that may bring about the oppposite effect. It being a family disease means even the members that come off as kind and loving may have very mean and manipulitive tendencies just below the surface. As sad and dysfunctional as it is, I've learned since marrying in to an alcoholic family that it's very dog-eat-dog and with most of the family members, anything I say or do can and will be used against me. I guess it's just how they learned to cope with all the dysfunction.

I also learned that if I talk about this disease to someone my husband is close to, how they react to the information is completely out of my hands. They may just talk to me and be supportive. They may cry and plead with my AH to stop. They may scream their heads off at him. They may give him ultimatums. They may abandon him enirely. I'm not saying that talking about it and those reactions are wrong, but if I'm not prepared to deal with the consequences, like my husband being very hurt and very angy with me, then I'd probably better just stick with the good, unbiased people in my Al-Anon meetings. :)

__________________


Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 24
Date:

Pinkchip - Thank you for your short and sweet response - I can see that he is ashamed of his actions,  and I respect that. I am not telling the world. I reached out to his father (his only local family) because I felt he had a right to know...my AH's treatment is not discussed as I have encouraged him to get those details from his son. I keep my updates to how the family is impacted and may be impacted by a guilty charge. ...child endangerment charges are scary as the outcome may have an impact on many people (two of the three children who were with him are mine from a previous relationship). I could lose my kids! 

 

Enouh of that, I was getting off topic. 

 

 

I agree - his response did remind me of something I would expect from my 12 yr old - not a grown man. My reponse to him was "you have no right to dictate who I can and cannot talk to, however I apologize if my discussions have upset you. I will consider providing more vague answers in the future. I will let him know that he needs to talk with you directly for details"....AH just stormed off. 

 

 

I will keep the focus on me and my children. It is just so hard to believe that keeping his information a secret is a good thing. Sigh.



-- Edited by EarlyBird on Friday 26th of June 2015 03:24:38 PM

__________________
Page 1 of 1  sorted by
 
Quick Reply

Please log in to post quick replies.