This is not al anon approved and it popped into my head as I was reading your post.  If you feel called, check out the work of Brene Brown.  She has done research on shame and when she did a TED talk, it went viral.  She has authored a few books...I found her work to be stunning.  There may be answers for you as there were for me.

I like to look at the simple answer first...Could it be that you are just "growing up" and this desire to do better is b/c you FEEL better about you?? could it be that you are just wanting to keep the focus on you, your potential and your individual wants/needs...working those steps, however is a good idea to get clarification....I always tend to ??? me when i strive/work to do better....it just might be that I, too, am growing out of those old labels of "reject, defect, useless, stupid broad"   those labels were them projecting their low life mentality and lives onto me.....program has freed me from bying into it anymore....I out grew my FOO...now I have my FOC....much healthier...much more in line w/my current thinking.......just saying

My first thought on reading your post Mark was to wonder what age you are and what that factor has to do with what you are going through. I'd say its probably all three; mid-life - the time in life when we all naturally look at where we are and lament not being far enough ahead compared to our childhood dreams of the future.

The fact that you stop and think and search out your motives is for me an example of your recovery. Non recovery and true slips are when we stop looking within and stop recognising issues, they are always there and I think it might always be that way.

I struggle with accepting me as good enough right now with all my faults, old motives creep in. I think doing some step work is a great idea. Getting out my readers, reading about the steps and the associated readings and then working through them is really powerful for me. Asking my hp for more awareness always works too, clarity will come and then I try to work on accepting it. Talking it over with your sponsor too. 

For me, this is an example of the power this program has for us, delving in and looking within, good for you.x

 

 

I can only respond with what I did Pink Chip...redoing the 4th and 9th is what I have done with my sponsorship.  The 4th Step suggest that we do it "SEARCHING....FEARLESS....AND MORAL (the difference between good and bad and right and wrong) and so I did 6 of them.  Of course the step also says "of our selves" and so I had to leave accusing and blaming others out of the process.  I didn't accuse or blame myself either cause I learned that if "I knew better chances are I would do better" I'm not a bad person...neither are you.   The slogan "Keep it simple" was a good guide for me so that I would not confuse the inventory with maybes and maybenots along the way...I needed to find the what before finding the why and then found out that often the whys might only be justifications I accepted to keep me in the condition rather than decide I needed to look for change.  You have good memory of what it was back then and a vision for change.   In between that is discovery and change the things I can time.  You are a different person than when you first got here so the 4th is going to be wider discovery...YAY for you.  My process also included(s) asking my HP the question "How do you see me"? and then going back into listening practice. 

I heard your "job" story at my morning meeting from another man in similar industry who was thinking of change including leaving it yet the director asked him "what will it take to keep you here".   He said "So I gave them what I thought was a ridiculous (on his part) demand".  "They accepted it without hesitation" was his response.  Often times my value is stated in mutual terms...my statement of it along with theirs.  Then comes my response.  Lets hear how you handle this current work.  Thanks for bringing it to the board.   ((((hugs))))

-- Edited by Jerry F on Saturday 8th of November 2014 04:13:30 PM

Like I just got a raise I wanted and am already plotting. I'm twisted I think. Praying to HP to be thankful for what I have and for this day, but I keep obsessing. In fact, if I'm not obsessing about 1 thing, it's another. I don't want to lose all of that quality because it keeps me striving and achieving...but like I said in the original post, I am aware it's not all from a healthy place.

And 6 years ago all I wanted was to stay sober more than anything...now I'm worrying about this stuff? I feel greedy and slimy kinda.

Well, if obsessing is part of who you are, then let it run it's course and eventually you will make a decision and it will be a good one!
I don't think we can force ourselves to think and be the same way every day. Some days I am weird and giggly. Some days I obsess over what I am going to do....and in the end what I do has very little to do with the obsessive things I was thinking about anyway...oh well. I think it's like tides, I am not the same every day.
Stop saying negative stuff about yourself though, that's not going to make anything better! I can't imagine someone who gives so much of themselves is especially greedy. And you look very clean in your pictures so probably not very slimy either.
Be in the moment maybe, that's probably what I would be telling myself.

((Mark)) I see great clarity and honesty in your recent post Program believes that all the answer are within you and that is where we must go for answers.

I do believe that reworking the Steps as you originally suggested will shed the light you need, With the Steps we go inward with a spiritual guide, and honesty attempt to see our true selves as Hp revels it to us The reading in the Cc states that alanon believes that by using the Steps we can go in and see the truth even if trained therapists find it hard to do

Sounds like you're 4th stepping right now. Sounds like expressed doubts including the compulsion of the mind description of us who had/have an addiction for alcohol. Also sound like proof for the psychological description of the alcoholic/addict as being risk takers. That last one fits me to a tee..."risk taker"!! Enablers also have that character with the "I can attitude" in spite of a more sane addition with it being "but should you". My sponsor taught me that one and gave me the slogan "When in doubt? Don'T" Ironically that is what his name was...Don T.

6 years ago the picture wasn't so crowded...Getting sober was the need and the goal and now you're alcohol free looking for some sobriety. Sober isn't only not drinking I was taught and last week meeting with my sponsor he outcome of an inventory was as if I was still working on my last drunk. That didn't suck...It was enlightening because it looked like and felt like and sounded like I relapsed mentally, emotionally and spiritual and had nothing to drink other my own risk taking, self centered attitudes.

It's good that they are giving you a free trial period so that you can get a more rational and honest look at the picture. Use it well. We alcoholics run out of luck about as fast as we do that first drink.

Last rehab I worked with agreed with me on a 5 month mutual look see and then we would come to a decision. After 5 months I left. I didn't like what I saw. All that is required of in our attendance is "One day at a time". (((hugs)))

It's the same company Catherine...the one that did just up my pay to keep me..not that it should matter. And this is my 7th month there. It would be driving to a much larger facility in West Palm.

Oh, well now - that is a different story. I got the impression it was an entirely different company. I missed that part of your post. Thanks for the clarification. So now that I've got that clear in my mind (mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa that I missed those words) - sounds like a great opportunity if you can stand a drive like that with high risk patients that can require a drive back at times or staying over night, I'm wondering? Other than that - whoopee!

And on second thought - well, whoopee, if it won't affect your marriage to drive that distance and have that much responsibility on your plate and if this is your HP's will for you and not self will bugging you.

-- Edited by grateful2be on Saturday 8th of November 2014 07:34:11 PM

-- Edited by grateful2be on Saturday 8th of November 2014 07:39:00 PM

-- Edited by grateful2be on Saturday 8th of November 2014 07:40:40 PM

-- Edited by grateful2be on Saturday 8th of November 2014 07:48:58 PM

As you keep sharing, I think it looks as if you are uncovering the exact nature of your wrongs Mark :0 Good work

Maybe, your not looking at the positives that are there as well. You are really good at what you do. You have came a long way, thats amazing. Your a pretty cool guy with a clear flair for recovery. People can see that about you. Youve got the confidence in your own abilities to be considering this job. Earning more than your parents is brilliant. A step 4 will bring out a balanced perspective I think. Let go and let god.

Pinkchip,you're very human admission of feeling sibling insecurity rather pulled my mother heartstrings. As a mother,each of my kids are different and were born with definite personalities. I have ideas about what industries those personalities are best suited to,but at the end of the day,what I most want is for them not to deny themselves their own essence. I have one son who will undoubtedly be materially wealthy. I still worry about his deep sensitivity. I have another son who is determined to join the army. I want to lock him in a tower. I have a daughter who is charming but doesn't think enough about others. I have a schoolteacher friend whose greatest fear was that her son would grow up and want to be a lawyer or an accountant,she was incredibly releived when he took an interest in social justice! My point is, that often the external attributes of success we pursue beleiving they will validate our worth overlook the beauty of who we are. I mentioned my kids because to me,my love and sense of parental achievement has nothing to do with how much they earn and everything to do with them being true to themselves and leading wholesome loved and loving lives. Do remind yourself of just how wonderful you are being,and not merely or solely doing. With lots of love, Edna.

You all make very good points. I would like to add that my family is very achievement oriented. My grandfather was a superintendent of schools. He had a Ph.D. My dad had a Ph.D. My mother was a teacher and stated she would have been a lawyer, but back when she was going to school there was overwhelming societal pressure for women to either be teachers or nurses, so she became a teacher. Now - given that, there was 1 year that I was going through puberty and I butched up my act and started clowning a bunch in junior high (8th grade to be exact). I got tired of being called a sissy and having no friends. I failed almost all my classes because all I cared about was making an impression on peers that year. My parents shamed the @#$% out of me. The whole family used to joke that I would have to get a GED and go to community college (which is an academically elitist horribly judgmental thing to say I know) but I equated it with being stupid at the time. They hauled my to a shrink (odd that I've chosen this as a career) who I hated and made fun of. They told every relative and friend of the family how I was failing in school. Flash forward - my sister is a lawyer and my mother lives vicariously through her. We will be at the dinner table having the most boring conversations about Maryland politics (sister is high up in Maryland senate) and I will pipe up and be like "I work to turn around serious drug dealers and thieves to try and salvage them into productive young adults" and they (mom especially) will be like "That's great Mark. Anyhow...about Maryland politics....blah blah blah..." They do say they are proud of me. They even say I've changed since AA and credit AA, though my mom will say stupid stuff like "I don't think you had that much of a drinking problem..." forgetting that she called me a drunk herself at one time.

So...because of that 1 year where I failed in school (and their reaction), and then when I had to drop out of my PhD program because I was coming out of the closet and having a mental breakdown at the same time - I have issues about achievement. Or rather....the issues that I already had were exacerbated. Honestly, I think if I made a million dollars a year, without working on the issues - it would not be "good enough." Either that, or I would try and brag to family and none of them would really care because they were never playing this game really anyhow. Mom stopped worrying about me that way and my sisters just want me to be happy as do my parents also. It's ME who is carrying this crap around.

Hi Mark Thanks for your honest reflections. As I have read through this thread I was reminded of the alanon slogan :"What others think of me is none of my business" it works well in my FOO.

He thinks if I take a position with a ton of drama and a long commute, I will stress out, go to less meetings, have less time with him, and not be as happy. He also understands that it may be worth considering depending on the pay.

Wow, Mark,  I can so relate to how you feel, my story is different, but no so much so in some areas...

in my FOO i was the smartest kid (not bragging) school was my sanctuary away from the abuse, i was on honor roll, inspite of his keeping me "busy" at night so i could never study, so i listened in class and that was it.....I hardly ever turned in homework b/c of his "nocturnal visits"  but I excelled anyway, Then I was sub-teacher when the regular teach was out, the principal would let ME teach...i loved it..wanted to be a teacher to help kids....my sire had other ideas..wanted me working for him in the office....i couldn't even choose my vocation.....most of the time i thought iw as a stupid broad (their words) but when i was i school, there was a teeny piece of me who knew that was NOT true

when i graduated, i had tutored a kid through our seniour year and at age 20 she managed to graduate legally and her parents came up to me and hugged me for getting Patty though on a C-  on final exams...Patty was just a tad "slow"  but with stories and visuals i tutored her...I cried when she pulled off a C- and she got her diploma......when her parents hugged me and called me their "little miracle maker"  i looked over at my parents and they couldn't have looked more disinterested...

that summer i ran away AGAIN to my FOC and he drug me back one final time b4 i would turn 18 and I ran off AGAIN...finally my grandfather said "send her to OK, i have had it w/this BS"  grandaddy didn't know just what was going on, the depth of it but he knew stuff was not right.....damage was done by then, i go to OK and i am in a bad crowd, drinking, smoking weed,  i had given up...no one even offered to help me get higher education, so i partied and numbed out, self medicated...i became a real problem, hanging with kids from the "other side of the tracks"  most of them indian or hispanic or "coconuts" (1/2 breeds)  like me, and  looked down upon b/c of our sad situations and we weren't white or only half white.....so i basically developed a "screw the world" attitude...there was a moonshiner  (OK was dry in the late 60's)  and we kids ran "hooch" for the guy, selling it to clubs who would serve it to their guests, so i became a little rum runner for a decent sized "business" in the north of OK city.....the cops ended up busting the place, but we kids were not there.....

I spiraled down into being  a drinking, wild child who just did not care anymore about life....no, i didn't want to harm others, but i am sure i "inconvenienced" a few folks just being the wild child I was

grandaddy couldn't handle me anymore so he shipped me back to the devil....the devil put me to work in his office but paid me JUST enough to buy personal items, gas for my mother's car which was now "mine" and that was it...he didn't want me moving out....i knew i had to get out b/c the abuse was starting up again......while there at devil's place, i went to goodwill, salvation army and bought all the books i could carry, first on bookkeeping, then studied up into accounting, where i could do income taxes...self taught but i learned my lessons well....i became a crack office manger and on site controller......as i said the abuse was ratcheting up and it was getting harder and harder to fight him off me....he was becoming obsessed w/me and I , being an adult, it wouldn't have been statuary rape on a minor, which he feared but  just incest and laws in those days were not much on victims rights, so i knew the hour glass was more on the bottom side then top...I had to GO...

sooo i went to an old fellow graduates dad who had this dilapidated old apartment house and i told him i would collect rents, clean up the place, order the oil for winter, do ANYthing if i could rent the little attic room , i confessed to him i was living in hell and needed out....he felt sorry for me and said "get your stuff"  i moved in while devil was out of town and i fixed up this "L" shaped room real cute...cleaned it up, scraped it down and repainted it,  painted the floor with deck paint,  got some cute rugs out of the goodwill donation box and made it real cute...I also purloined some clothing so on my "next job" i would dress nice... when devil came home he was PO'd big time that i had "pulled a slip on him"  my next step was to replace that job.....but i knew i had to do the important stuff first...like i demanded a raise from him  and when he said "no"  i told him "IRS audit is coming up and YOU NEED ME  or you can re-do all the general ledger yourself"   he had to meet my demands b/c I was the only one who knew how to keep his 2 sets of books, hide money and stuff, so as to parallel with the "show gov't set" of books.. and It was meet my demands or i would turn his ass in........so i got my raise to save up for my own car, my own way.....he found ways to keep me down, though and i found myself running in place it felt..not going back, but not moving forward as i needed to do ....so i did something about it..........

i was working PT at a fire department supplier to supplement my meager wages at his place and devil demanded I quit b/c he wanted my full devotion for his office....i told the owner of the fire dept. supplier my story and he said he wanted me on full time, i was the best bookkeeper he ever knew and trustworthy AND I was honest, so i was hired full time so his daughter who was not as good w/the books could handle the sales when they began supplying to the police as well........problem solved....i told the devil to go to hell and I was out of there....i packed up my stuff but did not turn in my keys.....

then devil began stalking me at my little apartment..i had moved out of the "L" shaped one and had a cute, 2nd floor flat in same bldg., same landlord whom i loved  w/ 1 bedroom , hall shaped kitchen and big living room and My OWN bathroom...I fixed it up too...."Rebel" the old landlord loved having me there b/c i really cleaned up the place and i paid my rent faithfully and collected from all the other tenants and brought the money to him, so i got the biggest flat and the cheapest rent....I also helped him do his books so i got paid for that....life was looking up but for one thing!!! ....devil was stalking me , showing up at my flat at all hours, offering me beer and snacks to "let me in" ..it was becoming a real problem, having to watch my comings and goings, waiting for him to jump out at me...my own DNA father, doing this to me??? UNREAL and it was gonna STOP...ONCE and for all.

I had a sister who needed a bookkeeper and furniture sales man and she wanted me b/c she knew she could trust me...I told her to save my job, I'll be there...this was California....3,000 miles away from Massachusetts and the devil...but i had to have traveling money....and money to set me up w/a car and eventually my own place b/c  "sister dearest" was not exactly one you wanted to be stuck with....

I contacted all of the devil's enemies and he had PLENTY..People whom he screwed at one time or another...the list was long........i knew the demon and his wife would be going to cape cod over labor day weekend and extended holiday, the last of the warm holidays, and so as planned he left for the summer place on Thur. night to have a LONG weekend, partying and going on his boat and stuff..while mom drank herself numb

So Fri night, I call the ones whom I knew would be "ok" for my "sale" and I told them to bring cash...lots of it...i was having a garage sale..a real bonanza on Sat, AM,  9am SHARP..Our bldg. was in the rear..Private...noone would see from the street and neighbor businesses NEVER were open on Sat...especially this last big summer weekend.......my plan was to do the sale, hide out at my BFF's house till my plane left on Sunday early evening...cheaper that way.....anyway, rewind to friday into Saturday....i am lining up my hide out place, (in case devil comes home early)  and i have a garage sale at my flat, moving out and into my BFF's house, so i G/sale what i am not giving over to the movers, and i make some decent cash..my last pay check at the fire supply place is already deposited in bank along w/my G/sale proceeds for MY stuff...So its lock up..turn in my keys to Rebel and go to BFF's house w/my clothes, toiletries, boxes that movers would pick up and I am GONE.......

Sat am, I am up early......i go the devil's shop  (we sold commercial laundry washers and dryers and serviced them so there were many of them in the shop either repaired or new for re-sale)   my "customers" show up and i sell out the entire shop, pocketing wads of cash and they haul off their "great deals" and the place is empty...Whim Wham, thank you Mam, it was over in less then 3 hours.......i pull the over head door shut,  cash stashed in my pocket and i leave for the last, very last time...I head for several banks...B4 they closed...I have to close out my bank account, turn svgs/checking into AMEX travelors checks, then i hop over to other banks and purchase AMEX checks with my "sale proceeds" and I am done....

sat. night, i am packing my duffel bag that my BFF's hubby gave me and of course my BFF /adopted sister wants to send me off w/some of her clothes to remind me of her...I copped some cute cups and plates at the shop and i gave them to her to think about me b/c really they were mine...so we had a somber sat. evening b/c this was IT..i was leaving.......i had a few grand on me in AMEX checks ...They gave me "booklets" with a stub for recording whom i write the AMEX check to, it was pretty cool....i stash this in my underclothing for plane ride b/c its all i got in the world to start life over

sunday arrives and i am finishing packing up my duffel bag, carry on bag and my purse and "D" and i exchange personal things with each other to stay bonded together for life....she tells me she loves me but can't bring herself to see me get on a plane, so her hubby and my other 2nd BFF go with me to see me off.."S" is crying...It was sad to leave my beloved friends/family, but I had to leave.....pinned in my undergarments is my AMEX checks and i got my stuff that i am carrying on plane as we roll to Boston to put me on plane

On the way to CA, I sorta "make friends" with the co-captain who was a HUNK....he sees me crying in my seat (plane had very few passengers) and he wants to know why one so cute is crying...I tell him I am leaving to start a new life and I miss my school mates/BFF's and this is big step for me...He stays w/me to comfort me and I gotta say, it was the most pleasant plane trip I can recall...We exchange tel numbers and then  we stop in TX and then off to CA and sister and BIL are at airport to pick me up...Co capt. gives me a hug and kiss on the cheek and says "i look forward to talking w/you soon, but will wait till you get settled in for a bit"  He was nice...Sister makes some comment that i can't even fly in a friggin plane w/out finding a guy.........so begins a new, very bumpy, very dysfunctional life b/c i am no where near recovery yet, as i would go through a marriage and begin another while in CA, I would job hop around, looking for that awesome place i could "drop anchor" in but it was the same ole  "grass is greener till i actually walk in their yard"  i guess the one good thing was when i took older sisters daughter away from her and finished raising her b/c of physical abuse perpetrated upon this innocent child by her own mother........I shined as a mother...I settled down...calmed down....I stayed in CA till 1992 when I would move to TX and be a mom again....... Motherhood was the ONE thing I didn't screw up ....I loved it...even the neighborhood kids here and there called me mama lioness b/c they felt safe and protected with me and i enjoyed their company.......to this day, I am "mama lioness" in this neighborhood...a name i am very proud of.....

TX was my "new beginning"  an end to my 2nd marriage, rearing 2 kids, as my niece/daughter was old enough and married now back in CA  and it was in TX i realized that i needed help for my problems...but that wouldn't be (recovery) till 2002...

So here i am...A mom...A grandmom..A cruisader for kids, animals, and other vulnerable creatures, 2 legged or 4, furry or feathered or hairless....Also I am a self taught barber, cert. pub. bookkeeper,  NOTHING close to my chosen vocation of elementary school teacher, but i make the best of it and NOONE ever again is gonna call me a "stupid broad" and a reject/defect b/c I know the truth now.....what others think is none of my business....I made myself...taught myself the things i would need to know to take care of me, my kids and my pets, etc., i MADE ME.....and i am still growing,  and will grow until i die...

POST SCRIPT....my younger bro, the A, who is my pal, said that when devil came home that sunday night, he wanted to stop at the shop first  (to this day "R" does not know who cleaned the place out...NOONE knew except my "customers"..later I told BFF/real sister)  he parks his car, throws up the over head door and there is NOTHING but cement, shelves bolted into the concrete and thats IT....OH the phones and desks were there, but everything else is GONE!!!!  he calls the cops...they begin investigation, that i hear led nowhere....the devil tries to get ahold of my eldist bro who knows nothing and he tries to locate me and i am GONE...flat empty since Fri. evening and I am Nowhere to be found...

Suspect?? Probably...But who was talking??? Not me and not his enemies who took pleasure getting even with him for his wrongs against them.....and it as all cash...."no name" on the invoice/receipt book with no signatures......and back in those days, i doubt he was gonna find a trail in all the banks i visited...yea, mine he could trace but the figures matched...nothing extraordinary there.....

Sure..He probably thought of me, but I had so much on him I could have hung him out to dry with the IRS...I kept evidence , just in case....my Bro said he heard him cursing my name as reality of my being LONG gone set in, but ya know??? yes, I did it and I have taken responsibility with me and my maker about it...Creator is "ok" with me b/c i was being stalked and chased by my own SIRE...He would chase off any male suitors I had , save for the brave few who weren't scared of him......

Yea, it was wrong what I did, but push me against a wall and I am gonna fight for me....sister had no clue as i set up bank accounts and used a PO box i got in my new town for my correspondence and i kept a very low profile, so she was clueless as to my personal business....I know i was the devil's #1 on the "hit parade" but suspicion is not proof...he probably went to his grave wondering how i did this to him and, of course , b/c he was so narcissistic,  WHY would I do this to him???  to this DAY....only my sponsor and BFF/sister know about it......and here, we are anonymous, lol and i think the statute of limitations has long expired on this that i did.....

anyway, i can relate to being the "doesn't count" child...if they weren't abusing/using me, I was a throw away kid...Thinking back on all this, makes me wonder HOW in the HELL did i survive and turn out half way decent?????   Must be an HP and a bunch of angels looking out for me.....

Sorry to have posted soo loooong on your thread, but your post brought up some memories.....