Why do people in Alanon say relapse is a part of recovery. - Al-Anon Family Group

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Why do people in Alanon say relapse is a part of recovery.

Mattie · ~*Service Worker*~

One of the times my A relapsed, he told me that his sponsor told him, "Relapse is part of the process. You get up, you get back on the horse." I think what the sponsor meant was, "Okay, it happened, but that's no reason to stay relapsed. Recovery is bigger than relapse. Now you've learned something. Back at it." However, my A took it as meaning "No big deal, no problem." So the subsequent relapses he approached with the same attitude - "No big deal, relapsing happens." Pretty soon it was a week of sobriety, a week of relapse. "No big deal, no problem." Then two weeks of relapse. Then ten years of drinking. Etc. He's still drinking.

So I think I get where the sponsor was coming from, but a determined A can twist it into a lack of fear about relapsing, and it's clear to me where that leads.

I think there needs to be an A-proof saying about relapsing. The one I use to encourage myself is "Fall down, get up, one motion."

Jerry F · ~*Service Worker*~

If I get the concern from where it is coming PC I say in AA relapse is about drinking again and in Al-Anon relapse means returning to our old patterns of thinking, feeling, behaving and spiritual conditioning. For us it isn't only about not drinking. A few weeks ago I had a relapse in my Al-Anon program recovery when I unconsciously resorted to shaming sarcasm on a fellow who works in the same industry and place that I do. I could not believe I resorted to it so easily and outside of my control and then I also recalled that prior to finding Al-Anon I use to behave that way with monotonous regularity. I also realized after inventory that I was overlooking some triggers which I thought I had control over. Drinking is a physical manifestation of the relapse into the disease and often thinking, feeling, and behaviors (other than drinking) not. Relapse is a trigger to returning to the peace of mind and serenity I have found in the AFG and therefore, for me, a part of the recovery or healing process. Gonna keep listening. (((Hugs))) smile

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Yep...I do get that. I guess we call those "lapses" or I have heard them called "bottoms in recovery" which basically means you didn't drink, but need a program overhaul. Lapses (with character defects) are part of recovery.

PP · ~*Service Worker*~

Interesting question so I looked up the definition of relapse according to Merriam-Webster: the act or an instance of backsliding, worsening, or subsiding.

I learned when I attended classes while my husband was in IOP that one is either in relapse or recovery. Applying this to me, it means my thoughts and behaviors are slipping and I get busy to move into recovery mode. Viewing this from an al anon perspective, when I see relapses in my husband's thoughts and behaviors, it is not a deal breaker as long as he moves quickly into recovery mode. If he had full blown relapse into use of substances, I would react very differently than I do when I see relapses in thoughts/behaviors. Maybe it is like a sliding scale?

cloudyskies · ~*Service Worker*~

"Relapse is not part of recovery, it's usually due to a lack of or abandonment of recovery. "

Hey PC, I'm glad you posted this, because this is what I was having a hard time accepting about myself. A couple of nights ago, I felt I had totally abandoned my program and reverted to some of my old behaviors. I think this upset me worse that seeing my AH. I could see how easily I could slip back into my "stinking thinking" pattern. I'm learning differently now. Just like in AA, slips are a part of the Al-Anon process. It's my choice whether or not I let the slips consume me. I choose not. I can learn from my slips and grow or I can become stagnant in my slips. I choose to grow.

Thanks for posting this.

It works if you work it.

neshema2 · ~*Service Worker*~

i think alanons have that mind set to protect them from expectations and many A's DO relapse...the percentages are not so good in beginnings but improve with time, as the A gets habituated in healthy thinking etc.....for the A?? relapse can be a death sentence if it continues....so yea, i can see where it would be very upsetting for an A to sponsor a new A and he relapses and tosses the old "part of the territory" thing....like he expects to slip and wants a pass

I know i relapse as a coda...i pick me up, assess the trigger and try to work on it so as to not repeat.......as a human being, i slip...i slide...but the good news is I learn and progress......progress not perfection.......

I see your point.....I am just giving MY take on this...others may differ....for us codas its not so life threatening to slip but its still a slip...for an A or a NA it can mean death or serious trouble.......my sponsor has been sober since late 80's....her approach is simple....when triggered, drag her butt to a meet, and/or call a recovery mate, get out her literature and assess step 4......no matter if it is coda/AA/ACA/alanon a slip or relapse begins with the mind as data enters it and the perception kicks in and then the emotions and then the behaviour....so for ME and MY attempts to cut down on coda slips, i stop and examine my perception or thought that precedes the negative emotions...

I hope this made sense..........I wish every one had your approach to your recovery.....congrats on 6 years sober........

Beatrice · Senior Member

I agree Pinkchip, your either in recovery or your not. No excuses. Saying relapse is normal in AA is a cop out and it encourages relapsing.

When we say we relapse in Alanon, it doesn't have the same consequences as continuing to drink does.

My opinion.

Bettina

Yes and good for you , 6 years sober, you should be proud.

el-cee · ~*Service Worker*~

Yes, it doesnt make sense really. I think that for me when my ex was trying to get sober then relapsed I would be terrified that he would give up trying so I would say things like that, you know, its a kind of im not powerless view, its desperation, well it was for me. Do people who get into recovery have a few attempts typically? I imagine in aa, its a sure sign of not working it.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

When I did LOTS of research, the numbers are super high that addicts go back to using after different length of times in recovery. When you just said your last sentence that is a relapse.

What I learned and have seen is most all addicts relapse at some time or another in their recovery. They get so involved in their lives, stop going to meetings, stop the talk, stop the recovery plan. Not being moral, lieing slipping away from their goal of working a recovery. It is a process.

Not just one day oops I messed up or I slipped. It doesn't mean it is bad or a horrible thing. Like they are weak. But things happen beyond their control that cause them to relapse. Many in a strong recovery have medical issues, once they go into surgery or are given something for pain, the body wakes up to this wonderful poison. Then recovery has to start all over again, and that person will be where they were in their disease when they went into recovery.

I don't like the numbers, where do they come from. But everything I have seen is 90-99% of addicts in recovery relapse.

I respect your thoughts, and I would never think well next is relapse for pinkchip. More if it did happen I would not freak out, I would know that sadly A's usually relapse at one time or another. and I would hope for whoever they were able to get right back into recovery.

Its like when people freak becuz they caught whoever drinking. Well of course they drink, they are an alcoholic.

So many times on here someones spose has gone to rehab. I cannot think of one that did not relapse, that went on to AA 90 in 90. cont with meetings etc. They are few and far between.

To say that relapse is a real possibility is not giving anyone an excuse. A's are going to use or not. We have no control over that. If you are an A in recovery and I say oh well you may relapse you know. Does not mean you will or I gave you permission to cuz I have no control over it anyway.

from experience and research is where I came to believe it is true. hugs, debilyn

-- Edited by Debilyn on Sunday 19th of October 2014 03:51:50 PM

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

Relapse is part of the addition cycle not part of recovery. I was just searching this. interesting....(c:

I was just thinking how so many are so hard on themselves when they yell at the A or what ever. They feel they failed. To me they as a lapse or relapse into old behavior, no big deal just figure out what went wrong and do better next time. think about it. when ever we are changing something about ourselves, learning how to ride a bike, swim, skate, fish whatever we don't just get it and that is that. It is a constant process. Sure we mess up, but the important thing is to keep going.

-- Edited by Debilyn on Sunday 19th of October 2014 03:58:38 PM

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

I read that if you make it to 5 years, your chance of relapse is less than 15 percent. I also know that I need to keep my recovery active not to be in the 15 percent that do. Knowing me, I would see myself relapsing on pain pills or something if it happened. Alcohol made me so sick. I still cringe thinking about it and all those hangovers.

neshema2 · ~*Service Worker*~

Hey Mark...Just wanted to thank you for starting this post....WOW...I am learning a lot from the replies.....I kinda agree with Debilyn re: the risk of relapse....didnt know the stats were so bad, but I always heard that in the early years, especially , that relapse risk is really high......sooo sad and makes me think just how difficult recovery from ANY type of addiction is and I feel , reading all this, compassion....not all addicts do horrible things to others, but it seems they are fighting a battle that is very very powerful....

i have a niece i love to death........meth/cocaine addict.......3 times in jail/prison the last violation......she has been clean for 3 years, living w/her mom now, my bio sister who loves to trigger and push buttons and actually gets glee when our brother or her daughter relapse......I send prayer to her each day to be able to get away from this woman b/c she needs ALL the help she can get to stay sober.......I can't count how many times she has been in rehab. only to relapse....I lost count, but i keep telling me..where there is life there is hope.....

I am a codependent which they say is a co-addict??? whatever, I know i have to watch and i STILL get into the sick thinking and i have slid down the coda rabbit hole a FEW times and i just keep trying to put one foot in front of the other....If i don't work on me and be "recovery minded" throughout my days EVERY day, I can revert to coda, sick thinking.....and also i am an aca....this crap is so deep seated within me, i must, like any A or NA work my program or I am gonna screw up...fall back....let old sick patterns come in......its a battlefield in my mind.....

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

I also know that those who do relapse shouldn't be too hard or too easy on themselves. They say that relapse should be a "kick upstairs and not downstairs." Hence, it needs to be learned from. And yes, most folks take a few tries for sobriety to stick
From an outsider, they would say I relapsed a few times. Before going to AA, I quit and relapsed multiple times. Just not from AA...yet...odaat.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

There are infinite variables too. Type of person you are, do you finish what you start, do you have a support system, then add in all the physical stuff too. and on and on you know?

Pinkchip you are doing great. I do agree, the cycle heading to a full relapse usually would be one sliding from what they do to stay in recovery.

Glad you brought this up! hugs!

grateful2be · ~*Service Worker*~

I really haven't heard that relapse is part of AA recovery in my Al-Anon circles. To me, relapse is a total return to old behaviors and a refusal or an inability to get back on the road to recovery. I do think that some As I've known have reneged and returned to recovery shortly after the slip and did not return totally to old behaviors or relapse.

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Oh yeah...and my mind is still often a mess. I just have better tools to clean it up. And I catch myself acting like a total a-hole sometimes so bad that it's even apparent to me when I'm doing it. Like with Cloudy skies's post, I was like "Crap! If that's relapse I am so there like 100 times over." Those freak out loss of serenity relapses get less and less though.

grateful2be · ~*Service Worker*~

I expect to regress in recovery from time to time. I think that is part of being human. Just me.

hotrod · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Mark, great discussion and great shares. I have accepted the AMA 's definition of alcoholism and that it is an incurable disease that can be arrested but never cured. By accepting this definition, I also accept the fact that relapse, as in any disease is a great possibility. I understand that if the accepted treatment for alcoholism is not maintained then relapse is a huge possibility.

Before my husband passed from cancer, he remained sober in AA for seven years without a relapse. He attended meetings daily, chaired meetings in the prisons and even when he was sick and unable to attend meetings his sponsor and several AA members would bring the meeting to our home on a daily basis. I do believe this is why his program was so strong.

My son on the other hand, became very confident of his sobriety after 10 years, attended meeting sporadically, believed he was cured and the results were a disaster. He definitely relapsed big time and could not regain his sobriety.

As for Al-Anon members, I believe that I am never cured and that one day at a time I'm granted a reprieve as long as I practice this program in all my affairs.

Flower49 · Senior Member

I have heard too that relapse is part of recovery and I won't buy that. I figure it this way, once you have the tools of the trade so to speak it then becomes a choice of using or not and taking the path back to the old behaviors. I have been told that I always have to keep my expectations of my AH super low so then I don't set myself up for failure and at times I think that is a cop out for me and a cop out for him. If no one holds expectations except for those of him always going to be one day closer to using again, then how does he see himself as being and trying to be the best he can be. Recovery speak at times seems to be just as cunning, powerful and baffling as the disease itself!

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