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Will try to make this short, i need to go to work. Anyway my AH tells me our daughter keeps telling him she wants us to stay together. Of course a child will say that! she is almost 9 Yrs old...still very young to understand the dynamics of alcoholism. He tells me he wants her to be able to talk about anything, but i feel he is putting her in the middle since he keeps telling me this. I told him to please quit asking her because it is an adult decision. He says he wouldn't want to stay married to me if we didn't have her because I am a "mean person." I swear he is a child inside a man's body. My sponsor totally agrees she needs to not be asked her opinion because that would be giving her power in a situation in which the adults have to decide what to do. my husbands substance abuse counselor way back in February told him she didn't think it was punitive of me to leave him and that sometimes couples need to split when there is alcoholism. She said this because he accused me of being punitive towards him. He always think I am the bad guy. I have decided to quit arguing with him about who is right or wrong because nobody will ever win!! This is exhausting. I am hoping nosey coworkers leave me alone today. thanks for letting me share.
Also...of course I feel horrible for my daughter...but I can't beat myself up over wanting to give her a better life and get a divorce. Divorce is not always bad for kids. But it still makes me feel guilty and sad. :(
As someone who DID leave .. and someone who's parent gave her the power to "make" grown up decisions it has devastating effects long term on a child and their belief they are now seen as an equal.
I will tell you I spoke to my daughter at length about how she would feel if her dad and I got back together, .. she was 12 at the time and I felt the conversation was appropriate as I was asking her opinion and she understands while I will take her opinion into consideration .. I am responsible for the decisions I make as I am the adult and I pay the price of these decisions. Something she shared with me and it stuck with me big time and a BIG factor on how I decided to handle things going forward was that she didn't want her dad to move home. She felt that it was better with him out of the house and his behavior had not changed at all. This was made very clear last year about this time. She was able to articulate that there was an underlying hostility that was always there. She also stated she liked the mom I am now the one who laughed and smiled .. who had fun vs being uptight all the time. She made the comment she couldn't remember me laughing and smiling ever and really being genuine about it. She also went on to talk about her anxiety. I will have you know .. I went into my bedroom and I cried .. I cried not because I missed my STBAX .. I cried because here I thought I was soooo smart and I had kept the affects of alcoholism away from the kids and that one conversation showed me in spades that no .. I hadn't .. I failed to protect my children .. and that no power on earth was going to be able to protect them except the God of my understanding. It was very clear that the way things were going had to change and that my relationship was over for me because nothing was changing. Well I was .. however he wasn't and I wasn't willing to continue to do damage to my children because it was easier than being alone.
My mother .. she gave me the power to decide who she married and asked me if she should marry him .. what the hell does a 15 year old know about those kinds of answers .. to this DAY she continues to blame me for the fact that my s/dad abused me after all he was my favorite teacher and that he was an alcoholic. I told her to marry him after all .. lol. Now I laugh .. years ago I was just straight up angry and one of the conversations we have had about it since I have been in alanon was she started down that path and I stopped her and said mom, you have to stop .. you were the adult I was the kid I'm sorry the end result was messy the reality is I never should have been asked that question to begin with .. no decision is still a decision and still comes with its own consequences good and the bad .. I'm no longer taking the responsibility for your decisions. PS - it's also my fault she filed for divorce when she did .. lol. I pushed her and so did her bff .. I have told her before she would probably be dead if it wasn't for the divorce and she would have zero relationship with her grandchildren if she was still involved with a pedophile. (I know hard words however good grief .. let it go it's been almost 20 years now) She hasn't brought it up since as I no longer buy what she's selling.
Dealing with an addict is like dealing with a perpetual toddler .. it's not an accident they refer to themselves in moments as King baby .. the recovering ones get it. Using these kinds of scare tactics on a child is not fair and very damaging. You will know when you know .. just like I did .. if and when it's time to leave .. his consequences for his choices are on him .. you only have to be responsible for your part and that's certainly NOT zero and it's NOT 100% either.
Hugs S :)
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Faith minus vulnerability and mystery equals extremism. If you've got all the answers, then don't call what you do "faith". - Brene Brown
"Whatever truth you own doesn't own you" - Gary John Bishop
Well I Can Tell you, My Parents Split when I was 9yrs old and it was caused to my Afather, Cheating on my Mom, Doing Coke and Drinking... My Parents did Not Ask My Opinion on their decission or did they ask my Siblings... Divorce is HARD on Everyone, but I Will say this... If My Parents Ask me at 9... And i Gave my Opinion, of Course I would have Said NO... Who wants there famly to split? and then they did the oppisite, it would then leave me feeling like my Opinion didn't matter! I am Grateful My Parents did Not Put me in the Middle of their Drama... I'm Grateful that Mom was Person Enough NOT To bash my Afather, when she had Every Right too... Yes.. I was Heart Broken that My Family had taking a New Road... but Truly... The Way they got along, the Mental/Physical Abuse My Mother Endured during those Last 3 years, was More then any Women should...
Divorce & Alcoholism Effects EVERYONE in the Family, but Children shouldn't be apart of Adult Conversation, It sends Mixed Feelings & Mix Emotions to an Already Depressing situation.... Because if that Child is anything Like "I" Was... They are Already Struggling with the Family Tention, and being Ask Repeatedly about what thier Parents should Do? Just "For Me" Would add to that ....
I'm Sorry you have to go thru this, and you are Def. in the Right place for Love & Support... But i Truly Pray your Husband will Leave your Children OUT of it! I know what it felt like when My Family Split and even tho I Seen the Ugliness in Our Home, I was Willing to Live there to keep them together..(Because I was a CHILD). And when they Split... I Felt AT 9yrs OLD... It was MY FAULT! I Never Spoke of It! Never Mentioned it, Just Sat in that Ugly Thought for YEARS... Trying to Figure out, How I Could be a 'Better Kid', and Maybe... Just Maybe they would get back together... IF ONLY I WAS A GOOD KID! That was The Emptiest Feeling I remember having in my life!
So... If I Stood where you did, I would have to Reassure My Child everytime the subjuct comes up, that Regardless of What Mom & Dad Decide, Let them Know it has NOTHING to do with them, NOTHING to do with how They act, or don't act, but more so that you want to make a Better Life for Everyone... A Nine Year old Should Not have to Carry the Burden of Adults... Never... But Remember, this Disease makes the Alcoholic Ill.... Their Thinking has been Distorded for Some time, so they do not see the damage it is causing the child, because they can't even see the damage it is doing to the marriage, their Health, the Work Etc...
Keep Taking Care of You! Keep Moving Closer to the Mom you want to be, and PLEASE Reassure your Child Often that Regardless of the Choices you both make it is Done out of LOVE For the Child, and Out of Making a Better Life for Them... One that is Less Stressful for All, Cause there is Perks to having Mom & Dad in Differant places... :)
THoughts & Prayers for you and Family... Please Take what you Like & Leave the Rest.... This was My Story, and All Story's are Differant.. Best advice ever given to me was "Go with your Gut" and the Rest will sort its self out...
Does he ask your daughter what kind of car you should buy? Whether you should put in a pool? Maybe he should start getting her opinions on whether he should be buying municipal bonds or stocks? Should he buy her a gun she can use for her personal protection?
No, only this one subject that he really wants to manipulate you with? Interesting...
She has no qualifications to discuss that subject, or of course any of the others above, the marriage is not between her and you guys, it is between you and him.
Our son didn't know that mom was AW for quite a long time. She had come through mononucleosis, and for a while all of us thought it was chronic fatigue syndrome when she passed out on the couch from having chugged vodka upstairs. Once it became clear to me that she was A, I didn't immediately inform our son. What would he have done with that? What could he do about that? Nothing. I didn't want him to be in the middle of something that had nothing to do with him, and he couldn't do anything about anyway.
Hello there I can honestly say l tryed to make my marriage work but it's was hard to keep to my program when I had a pushy A that was not true to his program which made me have no chose but to leave him for me to get better and I can tell you I'm still not better. But as far as what he tells you what the child say I would not believe him , of course he want you to think she wants you back together when in fact it's him that what that . Putting the child in the middle is the worst tool to use to get a point across , he has no idea how damaging it is to use the child as middle person.. My ex A did that for long time and now the children caught on to this and made there own choice not to talk to him because they no it's wrong and they see that the only time he wanted to talk to them was to use them he never cared about there well being he was still focusing on me and my new life and not working on himself .. I did ask my children that are 11 and 13 would they every want me to go back with dad and they said NO WAY. My son says to me why would you want to fight and cry again . Things are far from good for me and my kids we have very little lost everything due to my chose of freedom and my health . We are final divorced and I feel better . Manipulation is powerful special if you don't know how it's presented and working it threw the kids is wrong
Thanks everyone. I moved out in March and I know I couldn't live with AH again. Of course our daughter tells him she wants us together but she also told me she would only want that if we didn't fight. I told her nothing between her dad and I is her fault at all. He is using her as a tool to make me feel guilty I think. It won't work. I want her to have a better life. Being married doesn't always mean kids will have a better life.
